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Hello Tesla customers and enthusiasts,
As you have probably heard or read, there’s a lot happening at Tesla:
- Roadster production is now at a steady 80 cars per month, and will increase to over 100 cars per month this spring. We have delivered approximately 300 customers with another almost 1000 waiting for their Roadster, and we are taking new orders for delivery in late October 2009.
- At the Detroit Auto Show, we announced our co-operation with Daimler, the makers of Mercedes. Tesla will provide battery packs and chargers for an initial series of 1,000 SMART Electric Vehicles – and this could lead to many more.
- Also at Detroit, we announced the Roadster Sport, an even more powerful version of the Roadster. Deliveries of the Roadster Sport will start in June.
- European deliveries of the Roadster and Roadster Sport will start in late June, and we will announce the location of our first European showroom (in London, UK) in the next few weeks.
- We just recently announced the location of our Midwest sales and service center in Chicago, which will open later this Spring.
- And last but not least, we just unveiled a running prototype of our fully electric performance Sedan, the Model S, on March 26 .
All of this progress shows that Tesla’s technology and business model actually works in the real world. Despite the many electric concept cars, validation prototypes, and design studies seen at auto shows and in the media, Tesla is still the only car maker with a highway capable fully electric car that customers can actually buy. Customers drive their cars every day, and this is giving Tesla invaluable experience that our competitors can only hope for.
Now that production is in full swing, we have decided to simplify the reservation structure for the Roadster. Ahead of the roadster production launch last year, we put in place a two-tier structure ($60,000 reservation fee for customers who wished to lock in a production slot, $5,000 for those who didn’t). This made sense at the time – but we feel it’s now time to make things much simpler.
Effective immediately, new customers locking in a delivery slot for delivery after November 1st, 2009 will pay a refundable reservation fee of only $9,900 in the U.S. Our E.U., U.K., and Canada reservation programs now reflect a similar restructuring. These changes are reflected on the BUY section of the Tesla website.
The schedule for final payments remains the same for all customers: the remaining payment (less taxes and delivery charges) is due at the start of production of your car, approx. 3 months prior to delivery. Taxes and delivery charges are due upon delivery.
Customers already on the waiting list who have a production slot between now and October may request a partial refund of their initial reservation fee; but in doing so, they will forego their current production slot, and receive a new build slot after November 1st, 2009.
In summary, the initial threshold to Roadster ownership has now become much lower. For a reservation fee of only $9,900, you can lock in your production slot for the world’s only fully electric sports car. We hope that many of you will join us as we show the world that it is perfectly possible to drive without compromise – in a beautiful Tesla Roadster, with great performance and handling, while at the same time helping America cure its addiction to oil.
Kind regards,
Michael van der Sande
Senior Vice President
Global Sales, Marketing & Service
It looks like the link to the Model S page isn’t working… I just get a page not found message.
Other than that, this all sounds like great news!
Your Model S link is broken. I would love to see some official photos of the interior of the new car. (Reaches for his check book)
The link to the page for the S sedan is not working
I have just seen the pictures of the Model S: stunning!!! I want one! Tesla, slashes the down turn! Again, lots of succes.
Annnd—what about the Model S ??
When can we get stats and make reservations for it?
BTW—what is the size Amp/Volt of the disconnect we need in the garage to charge the Model S?
When can we order the Model S? I’m ready to put down money
You cannot put a reservation down on a Model S. I tried. It only says a Roadster on the buy page.
Wow, why does the S sedan look better than some coupes?
I wonder if the 5 minute battery swap is in partnership with ‘Better Place’?
So many questions, so few dollars. Well at least I have a couple of years to save up.
Outstanding!
The Model S looks awesome - even better than I was hoping for. Congratulations to Franz and his team for the fantastic work they have done on this. I’m putting down a deposit as soon as the website is able to take them.
The DOE just has to give you a loan now.
Seriously, Detroit, you could have given us this and chose not too.
The Model S is beautiful. Great job.
how about introducing the the most promising electric car into China, and maybe opening your plant here, because:
1. the labor cost is still so low
2. the talented people are abundent
3. the rich people are showing up every second
4. the automotive market in mainland china are growing at no.1 speed
5. government is giving rebate if you perchase evironment friendly cars
hope to see you suceed everywhere,
and most importantly,
hope to see you in China!
Congratulations to Tesla Motors!!
when will it come to China?
You can now sign up for the Sweet S!
I am going to sign up ASAP. You can now buy the car from the tesla site. What a car, and wow what a company. I toured the store in San Jose, and left knowing that my next car will be a Tesla. I love the sedan, perfect for our family.
300 mile range with how big battery pack? Normal pack is just for 160miles. How does it affect the performance? How much does it cost? What kind of charger is needed for that 45min fast charging? What about 300 mile battery pack and fast charging? Still 45 min? 480 volts and how many amps? Is that standard three phase connector or something else? Batteries are said to be “floor-mounted”, how does that affect the foot space inside the car? If I have bought the car and use battery swapping what guarantee you can give that my replacement battery pack has same performance as the one I used before? Can you give me refund for swapped bad battery pack?
Car looks good, but page is full of hype and not enough information. Hopefully some of these blogs will reveal more information about it as things get closer to be ready. At least starting price (which I would not buy) is right. $50000 which is roughly 36000€. I could perhaps buy one if I could get just one charging point between my home and my parents home. I would need to ask if one of the restaurants in Jyväskylä has enough juice to charge my car while I eat there. I would need roughly 150 miles more to complete the road trip.
I just browsed thru pictures from Model S. There is one of them that shows both Roadster and Model S side by side. If that is real world picture and not some photoshopped one then that Model S is _tiny_ car. Really small. What are the car dimensions? I can’t imagine myself driving long distances in such a small car.
Just beautiful. And seating for 5+2! And an extra front trunk! And optional all-wheel drive! Didn’t expect any of that.
My name is Stoian Kalniev. I have traveled all over the world and have family members working for the UN on sustainability and environmental projects. I have sent an e-mail to Tesla some months ago, but never received a reply.
Because of my family, we are very knowledgeable about “green tech”, and currently I live in Thailand. The Asian market is the one that is expanding very rapidly and welcomes current and new car makers into the market, with promise of profits (i.e. India, China, Japan being a car lover country, etc.). However, these countries really need to see the benefits of both Tesla models. I have been going around import companies and asking them if they know about electric cars and they look very puzzled.
You must enter this market if you want to finish your financial debts, reduce costs to make the vehicles cheaper
and make your product awareness and eventually conquer the vehicle industry. I also know that you get your batteries (maybe most of them) from the Thai market. If you open a factory here, you will drastically reduce your costs, allowing for a broader consumer range.
There are more reasons for me to explain why you should enter this market. Please reply to me to know if this plan is sound, so that I may build my confidence of one day seeing a Tesla (the sweetest, hottest, most useful car on earth) with my own 2 eyes on these roads.
Thank you and hope to hear from you soon
>> Just beautiful. And seating for 5+2! And an extra front trunk! And optional all-wheel drive! Didn’t expect any of that.
I was hopping for all this
Specsheet could be more straightforward and honest though. You won’t get 300miles range, 45minute charging for 50k USD.
Some interior shots of the seating areas and various cargo configurations would be greatly appreciated. Also the downloadable “spec sheet” isn’t a spec sheet, its a color brochure with lots of pretty pics and no tech specs.
Whoa… Did I see Canada in your post? Surely that deserves some more info?
I love it. I want it. (But will I fit in it? I’m 6′4″.) I’m eager to sit in the S to confirm.
From the photos I’m having a hard time picturing 5 adults and 2 kids fitting comfortably (unless a couple more seats are in the trunk under the hood
…but I’m eager for the evidence of experience.
My past is BMW 5 series, and I drive a Mini Clubman now (which I love).
Tried to download the S’s full spec sheet on multiple computers, and it doesn’t seem to be working. (The page says it is loading, then says it is done…but no .pdf actually displays in the browser or downloads to my machine. I look forward to the detail.)
I don’t think Tesla has much business in China. There are several Chinese car makers have already announced electric models. BYD announced a plugin hybrid that goes 60 miles with battery only. The price is about $20K. Chery announced all electric S18 which has 80mph top speed and about 80 mile range. The price is a little bit more than $10K. They are thinking about bring their e cars to US. So Tesla may face some tough competitions at the low end of the market. For the high end of the market, Tesla has no brand recognition in China. So rich people would rather buy a much slower BMW.
It looks…. pretty cool, actually. I am surprised, really surprised, since I actually do not like that basic Tesla (Roadster) design with its round forms, but still, I think you did it. A great design for a great car, and I really think… I’m going to buy it. I really hope Tesla’s cars will be sold in Europe soon.
On a sidenote: I can see now why Tesla sued Fisker.
I am completely blown away by the “Model S”/Whitestar. It is genuinely the vehicle that was long ago promised and is going to make a huge impact… and certainly is going to make a high bar set for the Chevy Volt to meet.
Assuming depreciation of the vehicle, a lifetime of about 5-7 years (please correct me if the Model S is intended to last longer), and slightly higher residential electrical rates than are currently found, gasoline priced at about $2.50/gallon, and about a typical daily commute of about 50 miles; I’d be curious regarding how the overall cost of ownership for the Model S compares to a typical full-sized ICE-powered Sedan. My gut feeling is that the cost is going to be very similar and perhaps even a little bit cheaper for the Model S, but it would be an interesting comparison.
I can come up with some number off the cuff to make this comparison at the moment, but the numbers I have are for the Roadster and not the Model S… and even that isn’t a completely fair comparison.
The days of blindly sending production and technology offshore just ended with the collapse. Local production is now key to keeping a tight grip on jobs, quality and IP; its the new thing. Markets who bet the farm on export need to build their own local economies.
Will the Model S be available in left hand drive configuration for the UK market?
Once again you have achieved great styling on the Model S. But now, you’ve also provided some great options and capabilities with the cargo space, onboard charger, quick-swap battery,and more! BRAVO! I highly applauded you on the Roadster in 2007 and early 2008, then some months later, in Summer 2008 BEFORE you announced your plans for the sedan, I then chastised Tesla for targeting ONLY the luxury car buyer with no apparent plans to make a practical EV for the middle classes. I apologize and retract my vehement criticism - Your Model S is the solution for the middle-class .
OK…onto another blog issue…
SOMEONE BLOGGED ABOUT BRINGING THIS THING TO CHINA. ARE YOU KIDDING?
Bring this to China and they will back-engineer, steal, and duplicate not just the technology but the entire assembly, fabrication, and Research&Development process. Sure, they can buy the car and tear it appart, but do you really want to make it even easier for them by putting an assemply plant there too? Why don’t you ask Tesla to give the Chinese the plans on how to make it, mass produce it, and all their future top-secret stuff? American Business and Engineering History has shown that everything invented in the U.S. that ran on electricity or electronics has been back-engineered and stolen by China and Japan.
NO!!! THIS CAR AND ITS TECHNOLOGY STAYS IN THE U.S FOR AS LONG AS IT CAN!!! LET CHINA EAT $4+ GASOLINE AS LONG AS THEY HAVE TO! AND LET THEIR 300,000 ENGINEERING GRADUATES EACH YEAR FIGURE IT OUT COMPLETELY ON THEIR OWN THIS TIME! (BTW, the US graduates only 50,000 engineers annually.) I consider myself a pretty darn good US Engineer, and it ticks me off that companies have just begun shifting high-paying highly-technical US engineering jobs to China and India - by only 100’s per year so far compared to 10,000’s per year for IT, call center, and software jobs.
Lastly, to the blogger who inquired about the size of the garage plug/disconnect (amps/volts). The Model S marketing literature states that it costs “only about $5 per 260 mile charge”. Given that electricity is California is about $0.19 to $0.24/KWH, my guess is it takes about 20-25KWH to fully charge the 260-mile battery packs. WOW! Not bad but not great either - The average small-to-middle sized Midwestern home uses ~25 KWH per day (daily average over a year).
The marketing also states that the 45-minute Quick-Charge is only when using 480Volts. So, my guess is it will take at least 2 times longer at 240 Volts (or 1.5 hours), and at least 4 times longer at 120V (or 3 hours). 20-25KWH to charge the battery over 3 hours at 120Volts equals 6.7-8.3 Kilowatts Per Hour (KWH). At 120V, the amount of electricity needed to charge a Model S 260-mile battery is similar to running a 3.5 ton 14SEER Air Conditioner for 3 straight hours, or about the smae time that AC unit runs each summer day.
So plan on a 50-70 Amp/120 Volt disconnect, or a 25-35A/240V one.
That charge “cord” is going to be expensive too…a 12 foot “cord” may have to be at least 6-gauge copper wire for each phase/pole+ground. And I doubt the NEC will allow anything less than a locking plug similar in function to those electric dryer plugs & outlets. (IT WILL BE A LONG WHILE BEFORE YOU FIND THIS WIRED AT HOTEL, RESTAURANT, AND REST AREA PARKING LOTS BETWEEN LA & NY… DO YA THINK SO TESLA???)
Tesla…maybe you can divulge more information about the charge equipment specs & details…and dispute my guestimates… but I doubt it. Anyway, great achievment with the Model S features and functionality. I’d buy it.
OK…one last point… I live in HOUSTON, TEXAS…LAND OF BIG OIL. When are you going to open a store here (versus China)??? I used to work for and promote Big Oil, but 5 years ago have since despised and deplored it. I’ve turned very GREEN and PRO-CLIMATE CHANGE. Why not STAB Big Oil by opening a store where it does the most damage? You’ve got customers here…half of them voted for Obama ya know, and actually despise that Bush idiot.
Are you intereste in to make a joint venture with Chinese vehicl plant ? Please give me your comments. Please send me your brochures for our refernece. The address is ; 228 N. Marguerita Ave. #E Alhambra, Ca. 91801
Good catch, Brian H. I didn’t notice 4WD possibility before reading your post. Now I’m VERY curious to read how that is done. Two front-wheel hub-motors + single high-power rear motor? What kind of specs for those motors? 4WD is optional? For how much $$?
If I buy one it will definitely have 4WD + 300mile battery pack. I probably also require two fast chargers and give one to some restaurant between my home and my parents home. Putting one in Jyväskylä could be made with other Model S Finnish buyers. Or maybe Fortum (power company that is building EV charging infrastructure _right now_ in Stockholm Sweden, and is considering it in here Finland) could create of those. That creates a question: how much does that fast charge charger cost?
Guys - well done ! The whole auto industry said it could not be done, well you had the dream and did it !
The S looks amazing, fit for purpose, good range and the styling - wow. If you plan to bring it to New Zealand I’d love to talk to you guys about a franchise (Ex Rolls Royce). I’ve been dying to get my hands on a full scale EV Car or EV sports car for years.
Keep up the amazing work.
Martin
GO GREEN, FOR SOLAR PANELS & WIND MILLS, WE WILL COME TO YOU
Having just seen the Model S release, all I can say is it is beautiful, an inspiring vehicle with fantastic performance and capabilities.
I’m enjoying the photos but want to see how in the world you can fit seven people into your S model. Any pictures showing the cars in their actual paint color would also be appreciated.
The Model S is absolutely beautiful. How about introducing a 4 door auto that is at 30k and about somewhere inbetween the Roadster and the Model S in size. If that isn’t perfect to the general public, I don’t know what would be?
Got your e-mail and saw the web page. Details such as real technical space, dimensions etc. Strategy to get people into show-room may not work. We ares still trying to get over Madoff.
I suggest you follow with e-mail to very interested buyers like me but with facts no hype. I want to read about independent test results and about your customer service. I also want to know how about battery exchange process. Thank you and wish you success.
What’s the estimated costing price of the PEM? How about the ESS as well? Thanks!
I am Chinese
when will it come to China?
Sales in China have plans for it?
Order may be considered acceptable to Chinese？
The “Tesla S” is really great! Hope to see it soon in Europe!
Kudos to the team at Tesla.
When I first heard that a production sedan would follow the roadster I was somewhat skeptical that it would be available anytime soon, but alas, here you are with a beautiful 4 door model. It looks as nice, or nicer than a Maserati ! I am impressed with the engineering and I hope to own one of these very soon……so please hurry up , I want to see one in the Miami showroom someday soon, and I can only hope my Lexus will hold up long enough to transition directly into the Tesla S Sedan completely bypassing a Chevy Volt! I forwarded my E Mail announcement to a friend of mine yesterday and he immediately placed his order ( yes…he BEAT me to it ! )
Steve W in Boca Raton FL
I think it is foolish to make the claim of being the world’s first mass production BEV to market 2-1/2 years before production! By the time the Model S is on the road, there will be many others. Tata’s Indica EV certainly qualifies for mass production and is slated to be on sale for the European market this summer.
Specifications are underwhelming. I expect many questions to be answered in the near future. One statement has me very curious, the charger is built into the car, including 480V 3ph. This is very good news. Am I correct in assuming that a standard industrial plug is all that is required? It certainly makes sense to have smart charge capability with night time charging controlled by the utility company to balance loads, but this communications connection does not have to be through the same cord as the power, could even be wireless. This very simple approach means that high power charge stations could be set up very easily at low cost. Is that 45 minute charge just for the minimal battery configuration? It is certainly theoretically possible that with higher amperage the 45 minutes could be applicable to all battery configurations.
Specifications I would like to see:
Battery:
What technology? Li-ion, LiFePO4, LiMn polymer?
Whr/kg, Whr/litre
Does battery pack have built in heating/cooling? Water cooled?
Plug configurations. Charging by public approved standards or proprietary (e.g. Agassi, and surcharges applied).
Lease, purchase? And prices.
Does base price include minimal battery pack?
Is the battery module design/specifications public? If it is, this would allow customers in the future to purchase replacement batteries from any source and thus have the possibility of upgrading to high performance or choosing economy.
Motor:
Is rear drive motor/powertrain identical to the Roadster?
I consider the AWD to be very desirable and would like more details. Does the front drive have hub motors?
What power are the front motor(s)?
What technology are front motor(s), same inductive as Roadster?
Since braking is mostly done by front wheels, does this increase the regenerative recovery vs rear only design?
What weight increase for front drive, and is space lost in the front trunk?
Cost of front drive.
Performance:
Top speed,
Acceleration with front drive.
Braking distance, with and without front drive.
Cornering acceleration in g’s.
Safety & Comfort:
Latest air bag technology?
Power steering, windows, rear view mirrors, seats.
Interior dimensions, max size for driver and passengers.
Minimum size for driver.
Interior photos including rearward view with camera placed against the interior rear view mirror.
I attended the unveiling on the 26th and rode in the Model S. Believe me, this car is spectacular!! It is a full sized sedan that is absolutely georgous and the ride is luxurious, of course quiet, smooth and fast. Everything has now changed in the automotive world, Tesla has proven it. This is not some immobile concept car, IT WORKS! While it seems extravagant to say this; Tesla will change geopolitical oil relationships.
This is The best Car, also can be use as back up energy supply for home
It has taken me a couple days to get to this post, simply because I have been stuck staring at the pictures of the Model S. It is absolutely STUNNING! The designer deserves a bonus (and no, I have no idea who the designer is). It has all the best elements of the Maserati and Ferrari brands, in my opinion. This WILL be my next vehicle, right after I pay off my mortgage. PLEASE don’t change a thing stylistically.
Based on the claims made, a great many of us are interested in pictures of the interior (preferably holding a 50-inch TV or a mountain bike!). I live in Indianapolis, and eagerly await your store in Chicago. Do you plan to have a prototype Model S available for inspection in this store? If not, I wholeheartedly suggest it.
Lastly, with the amazing versatility of the Model S (and the insta-torque of the EV drivetrain), could a Model S owner be able to attach a hitch to the vehicle? I currently trailer my motorcycle (and sometimes other cargo) with my Mazda 3, so I’m thinking this should be no problem for the Model S. A Class I hitch (2,000 lb towing capacity) would be plenty sufficient. For this to be “the only car I’ll ever need”, it will have to be able to tow, at least a little.
Onc again, great job with the Model S. “Whitestar” has exceeded all my expectations.
The Tesla S looks very nice, ut how about giving us at least some preliminary dimensions—length, width, height, wheelbase. We all know they may be “subject to change”, but at least we’ll have a better idea of what size it really is. Photos can be deceptive, and one person’s idea of what is “midsize” varies a lot from another’s. Is the S as big as a Prius? A Camry? A Quattroporte? A MkS? Some of us would like to know.
Love the new S model. Can we see some pics of the interior.
I want to have the distribution for Australia for Tesla products.
So hurry up and make a Right hand drive for UK and us Aussies.
I have showen the website to so many folks here, and they too want to buy Tesla cars for the next car purchase.
I want to buy an S model and be the first in Australia to own one….
Neil Rowland, Sydney, Australia.
The Model S is simply stunning. I have an idea President Obama…forget the GM bailout, let the doors close, break the UAW stranglehold, apply the billions targeted for GM to folks at Tesla, and reopen the plants under the Tesla banner, with immediate high output capacity for the Model S, the Roadster and future generations of pure electric vehicles.
Amos: There’s not much to tell about Canadian sales. There are no plans for Canadian stores yet, sales will be handled out of the U.S. stores. The important point is that it is now possible for Canadians to purchase Tesla cars, there are no regulatory hurdles to pass.
I Love this Car, it is now My Dream to own one ! It is by far the most well thought out Motor Vehicle in the WORLD! From the recycle of the battery to the ease of driving with a peace of mind knowing all information needed is on board..Thank You Tesla for taking your part in saving OUR Planet with this beautiful vehicle:)
You claim these cars are zero emission but are the emissions not displaced? The amount of coal that needs to be burned to power one of these cars creates a great deal of toxic emissions. I am interested to know what you think of this.
Comment in French, my english isn’t good enough.
La tesla Sedan est magnifique, vraiment.
D’après tout ce que j’ai pu voir on n’a que des avantages à en acheter une…
Ca donne vraiment envie.
Mais elle va être trop chère pour la plus grande majorité malheureusement et c’est dommage car mettre une telle merveille à la portée du plus grand nombre serait un pari peu risqué. Vu le produit, il serait vendu en énormes quantités.
Enfin, peut-être que lorsque j’aurai atteint l’âge de la pension elle sera vendue à prix démocratique, qui sait?
(j’ai 32 ans là)
Baissez le prix!! Produisez en masse!!
Vous ferez des heureux…
When you guys going public!?, So i can get my hands on a couple of 100,000 shares
Hello Mr Van Der Sand
I did not yet placed an order because you may not yet import in China !
Despite, I trully think you are on the right pace and develop wonderful products that will change tomorrow’s life for everyone. This is what I like !
I am a passionate follower of Tesla adventures since 2 years, but I realized it was not enough for me yet !
Passion is the key in the following lines as I am seeking for new challenges in industries that are leading tomorrow’s challenges. Car passionate., I a really willing to have the second part of my professional life in harmony with what I am the most enthusiastic & committed.
You are therofore the perfect contact to me to tell how I can support :
- All my life is about sales and challenges (15 years of sales, management & business development) so I could bring my skills in supporting your development.
- Strong abilities to understand technical products (10 years in IT, selling technical solutions)
- Excellent & up to date Brand marketing experiences,
- Proven skills in managing sales teams and achieving targets,
- Specialist in Asian markets where I leave today (but not limited to Shanghai where I leave today).
Looking froward to hear from you & Tesla Motors projects of developments. Available to send you more information about my records & abilities.
I really see your story as a great advneture, something that happens only once in a lifetime, where challenges are just whipped out by enthusiasm & passion.
CV by reply !
Best Regards,
Emmanuel PAGET
AngelE, I understand your sentiment, but if you look at both Teslas revealed so far, they assemble both UK made and designed cars Lotus and Aston Martin. Personally I think UK is very good at making small, expensive series cars, majority of the Formula One teams have their headquarters there for some reason.
China is better for massproducing things, same as Thailand, when price is the main objective, with the Tesla project, preformance is the main objective.
I rather seen a 3-seat design like the Matra Bagheera, but since Tesla have taken another route, I would like to see a 4wd
version like the Citroën 2CV Sahara, whom had two engines, rear and front which are syncronized.
SAAB is on the ropes and they have a very interesting 4wd system design now with Haldex (Swedish specialist in 4wd)
so perhaps that´s another option.
ecars, no, you are rong. Tesla Motors has very big advantange over Chinese brands like BYD and Chery whose technology can’t be compared with Tesla. BYD and Chery brands are low-end images for Chinese consumers.
It is a very good beginning for Tesla to sell high-end Roadster. Thanks to Internet, now more and more Chinese people noticed Tesla Motors. It is pretty easy to sell 5,000 Tesla Model S a year in China.
Go tesla!! Coming to China ASAP.
May Tesla best of luck.
—————-
ecars wrote on March 27th, 2009 at 11:31 am
I don’t think Tesla has much business in China. There are several Chinese car makers have already announced electric models. BYD announced a plugin hybrid that goes 60 miles with battery only. The price is about $20K. Chery announced all electric S18 which has 80mph top speed and about 80 mile range. The price is a little bit more than $10K. They are thinking about bring their e cars to US. So Tesla may face some tough competitions at the low end of the market. For the high end of the market, Tesla has no brand recognition in China. So rich people would rather buy a much slower BMW.
Yes ve can, cars end solar roofs
Tesla…. I have been watching. With the recent events at GM, have you been in talks with GM or only with Daimler? Your time has come. I know you can’t reveal when to go public, but when you do…. you won’t need Obama for money, just an invite to the Whitehouse to give you your reward. Let’s get this American Dream going and share your success with the country that awaits your product. Best of luck and I will be awaiting the investment opportunity.
I will happily get myself a Model S once I know more about the options and what they cost. The basic battery pack won’t do for me so I really want to know how much extra it will be for a bigger battery before I consider plunking down a deposit. I can’t very well run the numbers until I have them
. Hopefully I can save a little money towards this by keeping my existing car on the road until the Model S starts shipping in quantity.
Jesse, coal burned in power plant causes a lot less pollution than gasoline burned by car ICE, and not all electricity is produced by coal.
EV is much more efficient (and that is why it pollutes less) and can use variety of different energy sources. You can go entirely “green” using solar, wind, hydro and geothermal energies. Solar and geothermal have most potential (solar about couple of billion times and geothermal about 4000 times world current energy usage). It is sad that development of those technologies are so underfunded. Only reason to stay on using fossil fuels is that they are so cheap.
James,
It is not the first time better technology don’t win at last. Just look at Microsoft and all the companies it defeated. Don’t underestimate these Chinese auto players. At least Mr. Buffet wanted to invest in BYD, not Tesla.
Yes, there are a lot of internet users in China knew about Tesla. But like us, they can’t afford one. For those super rich in China, automobile is more of status symbol. In that aspect, Tesla carries no more weight than other well known names. Comparing US, there are less millionaires in China who can afford a Tesla. And among these millionaires, there are less percentage of them are environment aware. So I don’t know how did you draw the 5000 number.
James wrote on March 29th, 2009 at 11:38 pm
ecars, no, you are rong. Tesla Motors has very big advantange over Chinese brands like BYD and Chery whose technology can’t be compared with Tesla. BYD and Chery brands are low-end images for Chinese consumers.
It is a very good beginning for Tesla to sell high-end Roadster. Thanks to Internet, now more and more Chinese people noticed Tesla Motors. It is pretty easy to sell 5,000 Tesla Model S a year in China.
Go tesla!! Coming to China ASAP.
May Tesla best of luck.
Interesting. Japanese beat us in auto industry because they haven stolen our technology. Sure, let US keeps all its wonderful technologies in US and only print money to make up the trade deficit. In that way, we can go back to the good old days of US.
China has the world’s largest electric scooter user group. It is now building a high speed train network that can eliminate a lot of car and airplane usage. So I don’t know who will eat the $4/gallon gasoline at the end. I hope some darn good US engineers really do something to dig this country’s head out of sand.
Angel Evangelista wrote on March 27th, 2009 at 4:52 pm
Bring this to China and they will back-engineer, steal, and duplicate not just the technology but the entire assembly, fabrication, and Research&Development process. Sure, they can buy the car and tear it appart, but do you really want to make it even easier for them by putting an assemply plant there too? Why don’t you ask Tesla to give the Chinese the plans on how to make it, mass produce it, and all their future top-secret stuff? American Business and Engineering History has shown that everything invented in the U.S. that ran on electricity or electronics has been back-engineered and stolen by China and Japan.
NO!!! THIS CAR AND ITS TECHNOLOGY STAYS IN THE U.S FOR AS LONG AS IT CAN!!! LET CHINA EAT $4+ GASOLINE AS LONG AS THEY HAVE TO! AND LET THEIR 300,000 ENGINEERING GRADUATES EACH YEAR FIGURE IT OUT COMPLETELY ON THEIR OWN THIS TIME! (BTW, the US graduates only 50,000 engineers annually.) I consider myself a pretty darn good US Engineer, and it ticks me off that companies have just begun shifting high-paying highly-technical US engineering jobs to China and India - by only 100’s per year so far compared to 10,000’s per year for IT, call center, and software jobs.
Congrats on the Model S unveiling, it is gorgeous! You’ve really got revenge on Mr. Fiskar, the Model S outdoes the Karma in almost every area, and at a better price.
Incredibly, the Model S will create even more buzz and excitement than the Roadster, and will be an even bigger success. The Roadster pushed GM to start their Volt project, I wonder what the Model S will do to Detroit.
I’d love this car, but I’m 6′4″ - will I fit comfortably in the driver seat? When are you opening a dealership in the DC region? Because of my height, I like to sit in a car before I take delivery.
I’m also very interested in this $30k compact you guys want to do next!
Good luck! Tesla Motors is brilliant, not only for the technology, but for making it available and viable!
~TA
CM: “The Roadster pushed GM to start their Volt project, I wonder what the Model S will do to Detroit.”
Destroy them. Unless they adapt. And it seems that they are incapable of doing so.
I wonder, 2011-2012 is two to three years from now. Battery tech is showing incredible advancements in very near future, reaching maybe 400Wh/kg (maybe 1kWh/l) at the end of this year, and definitely being real life practical option three years from now.
Is the battery tech already chosen? If better batteries are available could you increase range to 600+miles with a price? I’m happy to pay 60-70k$ for 600 mile (real life) range car. That is still just about 52k€ (about same price as Audi A4 here in Finland, if new tax laws get thru) and I can afford that for practical non-toy car. Actually I would be happy with 450-500 mile range, but I think real breakpoint to make gas guzzlers obsolete is 600 miles with reasonable price.
600 miles with 400Wh/kg battery pack would weight less than Roadsters current battery pack (and as so takes less material to produce) so it should get similar price tag if the manufacturing costs are similar.
Very nice; can’t wait for them to start rolling. But you might want to re-think that all-glass roofline lest a Model S driver in the southwest spend half of the battery capacity on cooling!
Got 2 questions . Do these vehicles have a spare tire compartment ? And if so , where?
Great car! Two features I would love to see are:-
1.The addition of a small solar panel to drive the cars ventilation system when the car is parked. This would keep the cars interior temperature the same as the outside temperature on hot sunny days without reducing the range.
2. Active suspension – A team of MIT undergraduate students has invented a shock absorber that harnesses energy from small bumps in the road, generating electricity while it smoothes the ride more effectively than conventional shocks. MIT Senior Shakeel Avadhany and his teammates say they can produce up to a 10% improvement in overall vehicle fuel efficiency by using the regenerative shock absorbers. www.greencarcongress.com/2009/02/mit-students-de.html
Beautiful new Model S. But I wish that you would make one mod to all your cars; add a hitch to the back. Then encourage a company to produce a trailer with a motor/generator to power the car. The reason is that you NEED other companies to buy in and support you for add-ons. Creating the ability to add a new power source for LONG hauls, will not only beat back the hybrid’s marketing, but will have other companies coming to support you. If nothing else, look at the history of the VCR; Sony had a superior tech, but it wanted total control. VHS subbed out and had others come up with ideas that helped support it. Who won out?
Hmmm. Neo suggests doing a car plant in China. He mentions that the price of labor is low there, but that is largely due to the fixing of the RMB to the DLR. Instead, how about start exporting some Cars there instead and help reducing the deficit?
I have been following Tesla for 3 years. I hope the best for the company, and I am optimistic.
BUT ELON MUSK NEEDS TO GET HIS BUTT IN GEAR.
Detroit Electric will be marketing AND selling a full line of EVs NEXT year, and they are priced at about $25K and the design is pretty sharp. The Model S is beautiful and my hat’s off to all of you who have been working hard.
Check out this article published 2 days ago
detroit-electric.co.uk/media_centre.php?page=0
detroit-electric.co.uk/display_article.php?id=33
Go get’em Tesla!!!!
How much mAh & Volt of the battery set is?
Jesse:
With regards your question on the emissions displacement and the environmental cost of electricity, check out en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Roadster.
Specifically the section called “Petroleum-equivalent efficiency”.
Now, we all know information on Wikipedia should be taken with a grain of salt, but there’s also some truth in there. One would have to check verifiable resources, but it sure seems to me the electric vehicle, even powered by coal, is far more environmentally friendly than the standard ice vehicle.
Wtih regards any concern with the manufacturing and materials: there’s significantly less in the Tesla than in the equivalent ICE vehicle. After all, one must face the reality of a basic equation:
muffler - ICE yes, Tesla no
spark plug - ICE yes, Tesla no
windshield wipper - ICE yes, Tesla yes
etc.
If you can identify a single component in the Tesla that doesn’t exist in ICE (not counting the li-io battery, that peice is obvious), I’ll be greatly impressed. However, identification of hundreds (if not thousands) of parts in ICE that don’t exist in the Tesla is rather easy.
End results:
The roadster isn’t “environmentally free” with regards manufacturing and materials but it certainly requires significantly less than the ICE vehicle.
With regards the worst supply of electricity, the Tesla sure appears to be significantly cleaner than the equivalent ICE and - best of all - it has the potential - through such technology as solar - to be environmentally pure.
Dr J:
I disagree that Tesla Motors needs to move faster.
First, Detroit Electric may be competition and they may not be. Since Tesla started up there’s been a lot of potential competition, some of it has grown (Phoenix motors with their SUV), others have appeared to have gone nowhere so far (Chevy Volt). In my humble opinion, Tesla is the best of the lot.
Secondly, additional competition in the electric car market is good. The more electric vehicles get out to the market, the harder it will be for the ICE industry to contain them. That means both the electric vehicle companies and the consumers have much better odds of having the electric vehicle survive this time around.
Third, I prefer Tesla Motors not to increase their growth beyond a sustainable rate. I’d rather have to wait 5 to 15 years for a vehicle I can afford then see them go out of business because they expanded too fast. You do know one of the top reasons most start ups go out of business is because they expanded too fast right?
Go Team Tesla! My only concern is that you might be expanding a touch too fast, but that’s just me
You have earned to use Tesla’s name. Only thing left to do is to design people’s car.
You did a great movement with Tesla S, but you should do one more, you should profit your industrial advantage to become industry standard for battery interchange. Is in this point where the future is.
I’m curious. It says all-wheel-drive available. How will this be integrated? A 2nd electric motor for back wheels or just a standard setup like most all-wheel-drives on the road? Will the All wheel drive use more power while driving on highways and reduce the mileage on the car?
To anyone who wanted to see real life photos of Tesla Model S Gizmag has a good ones www.gizmag.com/tesla-model-s/11339/
Much better than Tesla own marketing page (this Gizmag page is linked in Tesla Media Coverage page).
Those pictures give some idea of how big (or small) the car really is and it even has some photos of the interior of the car.
I understand that this is just a prototype and many things (especially interiors) might change, but it *looks good*. Definitely one of the cars that I would like to own. However before I buy it I would still like to have that 450-600 mile range as option. Maybe it has it when it is available in Finland. Batteries get better fast now.
BTW. It looks like that car has pretty low ground clearance, which is good for highways, but I and my friends have summer cottages at the ends of quite rough roads (one of them can’t actually be called a road, more like a opening it the forest that you can drive in, so you can see other car tracks and follow them). Can you put in adjustable suspension so that you could increase ground clearance if you wish? As an option, if not as standard set?
Congratulations on the beautiful Tesla S! You certainly showed the world that performance, design and zero emission go together very well in an automotive package.
I’m looking forward to any future designs à la stationcar… Just for inspirational purposes I would like to mention José Diaz de la Vega’s 2003 “Versatility Concept Car” (www.volvocars.com/SiteCollectionImages/Flash%20Campaigns/ConceptCars/Gallery/VCC_VCC_1920_2.jpg). Just a thought.
GV;
Didn’t you catch it? Roadsters and Sports are on sale in Europe already, and I assume Model S will follow the same path.
Angel;
Actually, the 300 mi. pack holds 70kwh. Where I live, that costs $4.50. For you, probably $14. So my cost/mi is 1.3¢, and yours is 4.7¢ . If gas is $2.50/gal, That means I’d get 190mpg equivalent, and you’d get 53mpg equivalent. Actually, where I am gas is about $3.80/gal right now, so I’d get 290mpg equivalent. Not tea bags!
Thierry;
Here’s a response en anglais: Yes, it’s beautiful, yes, it would sell in huge numbers if it were cheaper, but Tesla will sell all it can make anyway. And 3 or so years after the Model S it should be putting out a car at half that price. So you will have one lots of time before you retire, even in France where you retire very young.
Anthony;
I understand there will be an IPO eventually, but here’s a quicker plan: Place paid orders for several Roadsters, Sports, and Model S’s, and then auction them off after a short wait. And tell us how much you are offered! I bet you’ll do pretty well.
Tom A;
There are no dealerships. TeslaMotors will own and operate every sales outlet and service depot.
i was wonder what company you would be teaming up with in Canada or if your company will be separate all together from the rest of the companies. where in canada would you locations be? such as Edmonton or Calgary Alberta?
PLEASE LET ME KNOW ABOUT YOUR PLANS FOR THE MEXICO MARKET, I ONE BE THE FIRST MEXICAN WITH A TESLA CAR!! AND IF THERE IS SOME OPORTUNITY TO HAVE A DISTRIBUTION HERE,PLEASE LET ME KNOW,I AM SO INTERSTED.THANKS.
Thanks Timo. I hadn’t seen a few of those shots before. I like the trunk and how easy it will be to get things in and out. Probably the lack of a trunk lip is necessary for those rear facing seats.
It did make me think of one concern though. With the trunk closed the trunk and rear bumper appear to form on continuous vertical surface. I got rear-ended a couple years ago at relatively low speed (about 25-30km/h), but there was still $2500 in damage to the rear of my car (new bumper cover, components inside the bumper, paint, other stuff and sales taxes) for the insurance companies to cover. I got lucky in that the bumper managed to prevent damage to my rear hatch. If someone rear-ended this version of the Model S there would be a serious chance of damaging the hatch. Hmmm, I wonder if you might also shatter that lovely rear window…
Don’t get me wrong - I love the Model S. I just don’t trust the drivers behind me.
Roger S : Thanks for the comment
I understand your position about slow growth, but let’s not forget, Tesla is already six years old with many hold overs from the EV1 years. I know about the “internal” shake-up resulting in the ousting of Mr. Eberhard, and the danger of expanding too quickly. I’m originally from Albuquerque and was saddened to know Tesla backed-out of my home state (not to mention San Jose). I appreciate Mr. Musk personal risk/investment, and I applaud him for his vision. But organizing and securing an American manufacturing plant shouldn’t be too hard. From what I read Detroit has plenty just waiting to be “re-tooled.” Viva Tesla!!!!
Imagine millions of pure electric cars returning to millions of suburban garages that have harvested sunlight from the roof-top. Juice for the next day’s commute. The technology exist right now; and all the bloggers on these pages have the enthusiasm to make this a reality- NOW!
Question about the seating arrangements:
It’s indicated the Tesla Sedan seats 7, 5 adults + 2 child seats. The question is: where would the children go?
2 adults up front + 3 in the back seat. It appears the only spot left for 2 children seats would be in the hatch-back section…..
Is that correct?
If so, I suspect the reason someone said 7 is marketing purposes and they haven’t considered the safety implications of having 2 children seats in the hatch-back section in a rear-end collision. Wouldn’t that be almost a certainty to seriously endanger the children? If so, isn’t it a very bad idea to claim 2 children seats for the hatchback and face serious potential future liability lawsuits?
If it does pass safety concerns, I’m one to be inclined to have my children in the relatively safe position of the back seats rather than the hatch-back. I’d have to see the results of a rear-end collision and the risk to individuals in the hatch-back section before I ever consider placing children there.
Brian H. You seem to know that 300 mile battery is 70kWh. Where did you get that info? I’m looking for more detailed info about Type S, but there seem to be no such thing in the net.
Seem funny that you mention $2.5 / gallon. Here in Finland gasoline costs 1.2€ / liter. Since one gallon is 3.785 liters one gallon costs here 4.542€ or $6.00 (nice round number). You have cheap gasoline there. One kWh of electricity costs about 0.0647€ that 70kWh would cost me 4.529€ or $6.00 (again, funny). Calculating that extremely difficult calculation I get 300mpg.
Electric car would pay itself back in few years just with reduced “fuel” costs and reduced need of service.
I just watch a segment on C-span with a panel of people talking about the future of auto manufacturing , in regards to electric and pluggin range extended vehicles. What bothered me is why Elon wasn’t invited to engage the discussion seeing is the gentleman moderating the the confrence was from Silicon Valley. Then after watching for a few minutes one of the guests was President of Fisker Automotive, then realizing that there were some legal issues between the Tesla and Fisker that it would have probably been an unpleasant confrence with the two market competiters … I did here the moderator mention the Tesla Roadster in regards to Chryslers’ similar ev electric sports car in comparison . But mainly the duscussion is why we seem to think that we have to rely on the big 3 to alone provide us with this technology when there are other players out there who are are just getting started and why the dod loans are important to everyone developing these new technologies . Its intersting how history repeats it self . Tesla gets the crap end of the stick while everyone else takes the credit and sits in the limelight..
Dear Mister van der Sande,
please contact me about selling Tesla on the Dutch (Holland) market.
kind regards E-J. Sok
Timo: In Finland gasoline costs 4.542€ / gallon or $6.00 / gallon, similar to Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania. In UK gasoline costs much higher than in Finland while in US much lower than in Finland.
Pure electric cars larger than Type S inpossible now.
Type S is the largest pure electric cars.
Hello .
My name is Daniel and i develope industrial projects in Spain. Now i am looking for companies that are developing electric cars to make the first factory here in Spain and make contracts with some potential costumers before make the factory.
I want contact with you because i think that we have a big opportunity to introduce your cars in Spain, and after in the rest of Europe.
If you are interested and please contact me because now is the moment to make it.
We can.
Best regards.
Daniel
Dear Tesla Motors:
I have been a faithful follower of your dynamic growth and development for years now, having been reading up on your accomplishments.
What if anything is your company doing to help hire some of the unfortunate people loosing jobs in Michigan and other auto-production cities?
This posture correlative with Tesla Motor’s growth would be a great story to tell paying your company even greater branding and public relations dividends.
I cannot order my Sedan Model as of yet, because I’m currently not working but look forward to getting a Model S, once I can.
Keep up the great work! Your most loyal brand admirer in Florida
Gene O.
Glad to see the Model S entered in the Progressive Automotive X Prize!
Akiharu Murase, I think larger vehicles like harvesters or similar big construction machines that don’t need huge range or speed could actually benefit more from electric engines than civilian cars. Hub-motors allow them to have easy all-wheel drive and more freedom of design (for harvester you could even make it walk using hydraulic struts with wheels at the end of them). Those vehicles also tend to be very expensive so comparative high price of the battery doesn’t hurt so much. Only problem is to get that “juice” in places they are used.
Some special vehicles like fire truck with very heavy load could also benefit greatly from huge torque and efficiency of electric engine as long as range is enough for it to reach target in time (and get back).
And then there is military. Some APC:s or tanks could benefit a lot from silent, low heat emission and high torque engine. Problem with those is same as with harvesters, you need a method of creating electricity in place or method of transporting it to target area. Good thing with those is that money isn’t an issue (or at least not as much as civilian vehicles). I wonder, if that Focus Fusion generator realizes itself, will we see truck-mounted portable nuclear power plant in next major war? Also I wonder what does 175kW power density with high energy density batteries mean in hand-held (or not-so hand-held) weapons. Do we get to see some sort of laser rifles? I hope not, but I’m afraid humans are very innovative when it comes to killing other humans.
I was just wondering, are you guys a corporation or a Private company.
In Japan, TBS TV network have broadcasted in the roport of your car and interview to Mr. Musk.
Good image report!
GOGO!
Dear Mr. van der Sande,
Please bring Tesla Motors to Hawaii. Although my new dream car, the S, is still out of my price range, having Tesla Motors in Hawaii would be like attending a perfect marriage. It’s impossible to drive intrastate, it would help Hawaii get off its addiction to oil, and we have all the sunshine power one could want.
If I were somehow able to afford the S, range would be more than adequate. With the mostly city driving I do, my old 1995 Chevrolet Camaro Z28 barely goes 200 mi on 1 full tank of gas anyway. Thank goodness I am fortunate enough to be able to safely commute to work by bike on most days.
Presumably like many others here, I am tired of ICE maintenance in general, buying gasoline that I don’t WANT to buy, and all the loud, noisy vehicles and stink exhaust here in Hawaii.
Hey Hiren;
I’m not well versed in the legalities of business descriptions, but here’s a question: can’t you have a privately owned Corporation?
In short: A single “shareholder” of the business, but the business is legally structured as a Corporation with a Board of Directors, etc.
So… Tesla Motors could be a “private company” by not being listed on any stock exchange, while at the same time being structured as a Corporation.
Hey Gene;
I can’t speak for Tesla Motors, but if it was my decision, I wouldn’t be hiring those individuals unless they parted ways with the automotive union. Until the Automotive Unions embrace the concept of alternative-to-ICE technologies, they will be quite harmful to the end result of the Electric Vehicle.
A very good example is the 2006 documentary called “Who killed the Electric Car?”. The documentary covers aspects ranging from the consumer through the manufacturers, the oil industry and the Government. The Electric Vehicle is as huge a threat to ICE technology as the automobile was to the horse-n-buggy. Consider all the industries that have built up around ICE that are not required for electric:
spark plug manufacturers
gas tank manufacturers
muffler manufacturers
carburetor manufacturers
The list continues and it’s a huge threat. The automotive unions cover the entire list. I believe this is one major reason why companies like Chevy are prefering to produce hybrids like the Volt over pure electric: a hybrid still requires ICE technology.
When people are faced with a future of unemployment due to their knowledge becoming obsolete they are faced with one of two things:
a) Fight the change so their skills are not obsolete
b) Get re-educated so they can have a new career
History has shown the bulk of the people will initially choose to fight. It’s only when they can fight no longer that they choose to change. The electric vehicle threatens ICE in the same way the vehicle threatened the horse-n-buggy. My prediction:
ICE will either disappear or be regulated (not by the Govnmt, but by the consumer and new technology) to be a small niche product, much like the horse-n-buggy today is a small niche product.
I won’t try and guess when that will occur. The ICE industry has been successfully holding back the electric vehicle since before the 1930’s.
# Roger S wrote:
# When people are faced with a future of unemployment due to their knowledge becoming
# obsolete they are faced with one of two things:
# a) Fight the change so their skills are not obsolete
# b) Get re-educated so they can have a new career
# History has shown the bulk of the people will initially choose to fight.
There is, of course a good reason for this, which you don’t need history to appreciate: Good pay usually requires top skills; most people cannot acquire or hone top skills without a large personal investment in time, effort and practice. Come along and tell them that their investment is now worthless, and soon you see mobs with torches and pitchforks — just as people are now doing when told that their FINANCIAL investments are depleted or worthless, thanks to the global economic meltdown. In the case of finances, hey, it’s just money, it’s just business. It can be very hard to lose a nest-egg; I don’t mean to belittle that at all. But for most people, their skills and job experience are their livelihoods. Even more than their financial investments, they have committed a large part of their selves and their finite time on earth to acquire these qualities. Say that those skills are worthless, and you are telling the people that they are worthless. It’s not necessarily true, but that is certainly how it feels at first. It happens in high-tech a lot, too. Try being a strong expert in a programming language or operating system that nobody uses anymore, or at least wants to pay money to have YOU use on their behalf. Real winners won’t quit in such situations; they’ll learn what they need to learn to keep going, but that said, the effort to retrain is a tall hurdle to jump — entirely equivalent to saying, “hey, your bank is out of business and your savings account is gone” — and anybody working on a “disruptive” technology needs to keep that in mind, if only to anticipate the ferocity of the resistance they are likely to encounter. There are ways to nullify that resistance, but to succeed at such a thing, you have to play the business game on the next level or two above most companies.
Hi,
Are there any plans to expand into Europe at all??
If so, I’d like to through in my hat to get involved.
Let me know if of interest at all.
Cheers
Carl
Absolutely James:
“people cannot acquire or hone top skills without a large personal investment in time, effort and practice”
That is absolutely correct. As you’ve indicated, you’re also absolutely correct in indicating they will be very passionate about such a situation.
“Try being a strong expert in a programming language or operating system that nobody uses anymore”
I’ll pass on that. From what I’ve observed of the people around me is they don’t realise the real value lies in the “soft skills” they have. I don’t mean “soft skills” in the deffinition most commonly used: language, people skills, etc. I mean “soft skills” in the sense of the skills most people don’t even acknowledge exist. The “foundation skills” if you prefer. Using your example of computer languages, the language itself would be a hard skill whereas the foundation would be the base logic common to all: no branch (logic flows direct with no changes), branching (”loop” structure, “if” structure). If you have the basics, picking up a new language consists of:
1) Learning the logic tools available (the functions built in to the language for example)
2) Learning the “grammer”, punctuation, line separation, etc
With that, any decent programmer can become profficient inside 6 months. The developer should be able to qualify for advanced within a year to a year and a half at most. Expertise…. depending on the level you wish to aim for can take considerably longer. Yup, two years investment to become advanced in a given platform is an investment but how much are you willing to invest in your future?
Secondly, when new technology hits the market, no one is an expert. Think of Java when businesses wanted 10 years experience in the language and the language had only been out for 6 months. Rather unrealistic expectation from the business minds who didn’t understand the technology. When a new technology becomes available - it doesn’t matter the field - people should sit down and re-evaluate the direction they want their careers to go:
1) Stay with the current technology and risk becoming obsolete
2) Be a pioneer in the new technology giving you front-line value
3) Patiently observe to see if the technology is going to be a “passing fad” then start investing for your future
Everyone has the soft skills I spoke of. The engineers at Ford have a lot of built up knowledge on the aerodynamics of vehicles among other things. Most of that knowledge would be extraordinarily beneficial to working on an electric vehicle. As a result, any of the retraining required would be significantly less then when they were first entering the field. The laws of thermodynamics didn’t change…. they don’t have to relearn that.
So you’re right, the initial investment to gain the foundation knowledge was very extensive. But…. the expectation that cost will occur again is unrealistic because the individual still has the foundation. They only need to adjust slightly to no longer be obsolete.
It’s funny how strong emotions can override something so basic so the average individual causes more harm to themselves in the long run by fighting rather then trying to adapt.
well to telll te truth this is my first time even knowing abou these kind of cars
Timo, larger pure electric cars are more difficult.
(technological difficulties)
Wow, I think you’ve got something there… Technologically, sociologically and aesthetically.
Hi :-
Have anyone here ever thought of one day, Cars will be run by “The Power of Magnet”? By just using magnets , we can generate electric power to move the car, and best of all, it runs 24 hours by itself without any charging.
We have just finished the first phase of testing, using magnet to run a computer fan 24 hrs without stoping, without charging. This is only a small project, and we need time and more experts to join us to use this method to replace the traditional method of producing electricity.
We need big investors who have the passion to save the earth, to continue this project. I am sure one day, our house, offices, vehicles are runing 24 hrs using self-installed magnet without charhing and without having to pay any electric bills. We are sure using magnet to generate electricity can also be applied on space projects.
Help us to make this possible. Sincere investors and companies are welcome to contact my team for more details.
Hi Michael,
Just wanted to let you know that you seem to have hired an excellent guy for the German speaking countries.
He’s very knowledgeable and doesn’t mind to get in touch any day of the week. Very impressive.
I don’t know whether you remember that I threw my hat in to help start Tesla in Europe but you clearly have found
someone very suitable.
Give the right approach you may be able to shake some of the best automobile manufacturers in the world out of their trees.
All the best
Carl
Did Tesla read that article on CNN today? Would that improved performance electric motor technology work in the Tesla’s engine? If so, it would seem that you could get the same range on less batteries. Hence cutting weight and costs.
www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/04/20/eco.electricscooter/index.html
Also, there have been several breakthru’s in the last year on batteries that charge in under 10 minutes. Is Tesla looking into those? The Lightning Car in Europe, their copy of the Tesla, already uses the 10 minute charge batteries.
Keep the future coming guys.
NinjaHero: Tesla is well aware of the value of high efficiency motors. They spent a large portion of their development time for the Roadster designing their own electric motor which is one of the highest efficiencies and probably the highest power to weight electric motor in the world. Tesla’s motor is 95% to98% efficient, can’t get much better than that. Most motors run 70% to 95%. This article claiming 50% improvement would only be true in comparison with the worst ones out there.
Hey NinjaHero: You appear a bit behind on the technology. If you review the FAQs and other technology related links on the Tesla site, they are quite enlightening. Roy has already pointed out the engine work.
Another is your comment with regards the “Lightning Car” in Europe using 10 minute charge batteries. If you examine the information available, you’ll realise that Tesla uses Lithium Ion battery technology. That technology has been getting flash charged in 10 minutes for quite some time. The Hyatt Regency hotel chain has put recharging stations in three of their hotels already: www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/08/30/BUKERRNPR.DTL
If you meant “charging in 10 minutes at home” then I must point out the limitations of such capabilities. A 110 volt outlet charges the 52 KwHr battery in 7 hours, a 220 volt outlet charges the battery in 3.5 hours. Based on that, a simple calculation would be 7 * 60 = 420 minutes, 3.5 * 60 = 210 minutes, 420/210 = a factor of 2. 2 * 110 volts = 220 volts. I’m sure this simple algorithm won’t work with higher voltages, but it’s what I have to work with.
So, to calculate how much voltage must be provided to charge in 10 minutes: 420 / 10 = a factor of 42. 42 * 110 volts = 4620 volts…. or 4.6 kilovolts. I’d be surprised if any regulation allowed a standard household to have that kind of output at this point in time. So… I’d be surprised if that Lightning Car is being claimed to be able to be charged in 10 minutes at your home unless it’s total storage is significanly smaller than what the Tesla battery holds.
Based on the site for the Lightning, www.lightningcarcompany.co.uk/technical.php, the battery stores 36 Kwhrs of electricity. So… if - and I highly doubt this is reasonable - the math can be applied straight, if 56 KwHrs take 7 hours on a 110 outlet, 36 outta take 270 minutes (4.5 hours), based on that we have a factor of 27 and a voltage of 2970, or 2.97 Kvolts. Their Q/A identifies the answer to how fast can their battery charge:
“Overnight using a domestic power supply, a couple of hours using a 3 phase power supply and just 10 minutes using a fast charge unit. ”
What they don’t note is where the location of those chargers are.
Interesting, a little further they have another note on the subject:
“Standard single phase home type power source can be used to charge overnight and is available just about anywhere by using the onboard charger. For a fast charge a 3 phase power supply is required and with the interest in electric powered vehicles increasing significantly, more high power charging stations will be installed. Most garage forecourt and industrial areas already have this level of high power source available and therefore can be fitted with a universal charging station”
I have no idea what a “garage forecourt” is and I would certainly be surprised if the standard home is outfitted as an “industrial area”.
So… if you thought you could charge your electric car at home in 10 minutes, you might want to look into what it takes to accomplish that and if the regulations allow such an outfitting on your home.
Note to the Tesla Battery Techies: I’d appreciate any corrections in the above on my math. For example, I suspect changing amperage to have a significant impact considering volts * amps = wattage.
Caveat: from the statement that the “single phase home type power source can be used to charge overnight ” rather than in 4.5 hours, it’s almost a certainty my calculation is incorrect somewhere…. like assuming Europe has a 110 volt outlets?
:)
Akiharu Murase, I don’t think larger electric vehicles are at all harder technically than smaller ones, in fact I believe it is just opposite. Only problem is that larger vehicle needs bigger batteries to run that same distance, but by comparison car weight battery weight in those vehicles would be less than in smaller vehicles, so the problem is high price of the batteries, not the size. We already have very large vehicles running electric motors, like diesel locomotives (they are basically simple serial hybrid EV:s). Same components that run Tesla Roadster could run 18-wheeler truck without any difficulties, just shorter distance.
I’m living [if you can call it that] on SSD, and can’t possibly buy one of your fabulous cars. However, I think I’m in love with the Compamy! Always had a pash for N. Tesla - think what he could have done with computers! Anyway, I’d like to know how much your stock costs, and how I can but some - this is the best greening investment I’ve seen! I’m 60+ and may never see it, but by golly, I want to invest in a REAL FUTURE!
Just watched your show on Nova, PBS, and came straight to my computer! Thank you for naming your company after Tesla - he did so much, and so few know him.
Good luck [which I’m pretty sure you will make for yourselves] in all your endeavors!
Roger S wrote, “With that, any decent programmer can become profficient inside 6 months. The developer should be able to qualify for advanced within a year to a year and a half at most…”
It is rarely goes that smoothly. Or more properly, it might go that smoothly for people in that situation WHO GET HIRED. But convincing a hiring manager to take a chance and launch a “startover” candidate on that trajectory is not nearly so cut and dried. It boils down to timing, connections, personal “soft skills” (including confidence and persuasive ability), and quite a few other intangible qualities. I’ve seen this dynamic from both sides, as a hiring manager and as someone looking for work, at various times over the past several decades. So while I can agree with Roger in the abstract, events often play out differently when “the rubber hits the road.”
When people understand the situation as Roger described it — when they know that what Roger calls “soft skills” and I call “transferable skills” can ensure their success in a “startover” trajectory, but also understand that there is a fair amount of chance and a large number of uncontrollable variables involved in just getting to the point of following that trajectory — they will naturally be skeptical about and even militantly opposed to change, unless they see that the change really IS beneficial to them and society or industry in general, and unless they see their own clear path for trading on their transferable skills to acquire and master new ones that will be valuable in the changed world. Getting workers to see such things, thus winnowing the ranks of opponents by converting them into allies, is what very smart agents of change do; that is what I meant by “playing the game” at a higher level. It’s also important to play a “win-win” game whenever possible. Yes, there are winners and losers in business. But the essence of business is the successful trade, which is a “win-win”: each party walks away with something he valued more than the thing he brought to the table. This is how wealth is created and distributed. When business is conducted in win-lose or lose-lose mode, wealth is DESTROYED, so the savvy players try to stay in “win-win” mode as much as they can.
Tony Phee: An unmoving magnet will not produce any electricity at all. The magnetic field must move or change in strength to produce an electric current in a wire. There is an “electrodynamic drag” resisting that movement that is proportional to the electrical power produced, which is why electric generators need a source of mechanical power to keep them spinning.
Now you can produce some energy by attracting steel to a magnet, but it is like getting energy from a spring or energy from a weight on a pully - it only works for a while then stops - the spring unwinds, the weight hits the ground, the magnet contacts the steel. Then you must apply energy to reset it - rewind the spring, lift the weight, pull the magnet away from the steel. Magnets are not an unlimited energy source for the same reason springs don’t wind themselves and weights don’t lift themselves. Sorry, there is no shortcut or way around it, that’s the way the universe works.
Roger S:
If you go to the Merchandise section of this website, and look under Charging, you will see the three main available methods of charging the Tesla Roadster, along with the estimated charging times. Here is what is says about them:
“By default, the 120V Mobile Connector will recharge the car at a rate of approximately 4 miles for every hour it is connected. At this charge rate, the car will go from 0% state of charge to 100% state of charge in approximately 48 hours.
When plugged into a NEMA 5-20 receptacle, the user may set their Tesla vehicle to charge at 16 Amps using the Vehicle Display System. In this mode, the 120V Mobile Connector will recharge the car at a rate of approximately 5 miles for every hour it is connected. At this charge rate, the car will go from 0% state of charge to 100% state of charge in about 37 hours. (So the 110 volt outlet is not capable of charging the car in 7 hours as you hypothesized)
The lowest cost high power option requiring no third party installation is the 240V Mobile Connector. The 240V Mobile Connector is a portable cord-set with a type NEMA (National Electrical Manufacturers Association) 14-50 plug, integrated GFCI (ground fault circuit interrupter) and Tesla vehicle connector. The 240V Mobile Connector can supply up to 30 amps AC to the vehicle and is 15 feet long. At maximum power (30 Amps) the 240V Mobile Connector will recharge the car at a rate of approximately 24 miles for every hour it is connected. At this charge rate, the car will go from 0% state of charge to 100% state of charge overnight (about 8 hours).
The fastest way to charge your Tesla vehicle, the High Power Connector is a unit that is hard wired to a single phase breaker panel. It can supply up to 70 Amps at 240 volts. The unit consists of a GFCI (ground fault circuit interrupter), cable hanger, 25 foot cord and Tesla vehicle connector. At maximum power (70 Amps), the High Power Connector will allow the car to charge at a rate of approximately 56 miles for every hour it is connected. At this charge rate, the car will go from 0% state of charge to 100% state of charge in about 3.5 hours.”
So basically, the standard home 110/120 volt outlet (minimum total recharge time of 37 hours) is not the preferred method for overnight charging. You want to use either the 220/240 volt dryer outlet (8 - 10 hours) or Tesla’s dedicated high power charger (3.5 - 10 hours, depending on amperage). I think it is this latter unit that has been or will be installed at the 3 Hyatts you noted. Either way you can’t get a full recharge of the Roadster battery pack in 10 minutes there (if that was what you were inferring). Although some li ion battery chemistries are capable of receiving a 10 minute quick charge, like the Altairnano lithium titanate batteries (I think Lightning may be using those), I don’t believe the more ‘traditional’ li ion battery chemistry that Tesla currently uses is capable of this (at least not safely).
Hey Pete A.
Thanks for validating my sanity
I believe I understood the 3.5 vs 7 hours based on the media reportings or comments that were not accurate although I could have sworn I got that information from the FAQ’s. I can’t find it now though so it must have been my imagination.
Thanks for pointing out where to find that valuable information. The math utilizing the previous numbers were simply not working and I was wondering where I was going wrong. Plugging in the information you identified immediately clarifies where I was going wrong: bad initial information producing invalid numbers.
I certainly was not expecting to find such useful information in the merchandise area, and with no reason to currently wander into that area, I’ve simply not explored there. I know, shame on me for not getting at least a t-shirt
I am surprised to find out the chargers going into the Hyatt aren’t able to flash charge to 90% in 10 minutes. I guess I was taking it for granted that Tesla had used appropriate Li Ion technology. A bad assumption on my part. So… on that note, I stand corrected for “correcting” NinjaHero on that point.
With the additional info, I’m more inclined to believe the possibility of flash-charging one’s vehicle with a 10 minute charge at home is even further out of reach.
Roger S. Europe standard for electricity is 230V 50Hz, so we get twice the power here using same amperage from standard outlet. This outlet is not same everywhere in Europe, but for most parts it is, and voltage is usually between 220-240V and 50Hz.
users.telenet.be/worldstandards/electricity.htm
Three phase connectors also are more common here, I believe. Can’t say for sure about other countries, but ordinary household electric oven is usually connected using three-phase current, and here in Finland nearly every house has Sauna heater that, if electric, uses three phase current, so getting three-phase connector in your garage is just matter of wiring, nothing more.
We also have here in Finland standard 230V electric outlets basically in every residential parking lot because we (have to) use engine block heaters in winter time, so we already have “slow charging points” everywhere
Getting 36kWh out of European three phase connector in 10 minutes would take 36000 * 6 / 380 = 568 amps. A lot. Too much. That fast charger unit lightning page talks must use battery to battery charging and huge amps and/or volts.
OTOH using three-phase you can get 36kWh out of it in an hour by just 100A current, and that is not huge amps, and entirely possible for normal house, though unusual.
Pete A: while true that current Tesla battery pack can’t be charged in 10 minutes, that will change. I just recently read article from Nature where they have managed to get 175kW/kg power density out of ordinary lithium-ion battery by just changing the way they are build, and that means potential of charging/discharging whole battery in seconds. Enormous power for short period of time out of small battery. Imagine drilling with battery drill that has more than 100HP turning power. And then imagine your wrist when that drill bit stops for some reason.
Timo: Roger S. Europe standard for electricity is 230V 50Hz, so we get twice the power here using same amperage from standard outlet. This outlet is not same everywhere in Europe, but for most parts it is, and voltage is usually between 220-240V and 50Hz.
users.telenet.be/worldstandards/electricity.htm
In Russia, voltage is 230V/50Hz
In the Netherlands and south part of France, voltage has been 100V/50Hz
Roger S and Pete A, if you want faster charge, electricity needs lower frequency. direct curremt, single phase 16.7Hz or three phase 16.7Hz, no more than 600V and very high amps.
I am quite surprised by CNBC that on several occasions when touting new and green vehicles Tesla Motors seems to get snubbed. Even while discussing cars such as the Dodge Circuit which is similar to the Tesla Roadster as this is derived from the Lotus Elise vehicle. What I do not understand concerns Tesla Motors being eliminated from discussion of green vehicles even though Tesla has and is producing cars as we speak but CNBC only concerns itself with Detroit based vehicles which are in many instances future possibilities. Is Tesla being snubbed for a reason? How does Tesla deal with this oversight or philosophy of simply being ignored?
I think that this is the future of car making… just wondering if you can partner with a power car maker, such as lexus or audi. This way, those of us that do not live on the west coast could have an opportunity to visit a showroom and / or make a purchase… accessiblity to potentail consumers is big.
Timo & Akiharu;
The Port of LA is already putting together a fleet of heavy-duty yard and local container delivery trucks which are pure electric. The drivers love the silence, power, and lack of stink! They have a 40-60 mile range, quite adequate for the short-haul jobs they are doing.
www.latimes.com/news/local/la-fi-electric-truck25-2009feb25,0,4745152.story
www.portoflosangeles.org/newsroom/2008_releases/news_051608_et.asp
“The operating cost of the electric truck is 15 percent of the current fossil fuel powered vehicles used in similar application,” said Balwinder Samra, CEO of Balqon Corporation. “Due to high idling time that drayage trucks typically endure, we think the annual savings for truck operators could be $35,000 or more.”
What is wrong with some of these car magazines, and internet green car sites, most of them have not heard about the Tesla, or they are a party to big business and do not want the electric car to succeed. We as Americans need to start a campaign, everytime we see a magazine on line, or an electric car site that does not talk about the Tesla, we need to stand up and flood their issues with information about the Tesla.
It seems like they are boycotting the greatest electric car ever built. I cannot wait to get mine, I am buying one for my wife soon. Awsome. Go, Tesla!
If DC is more practical to charge electric cars, the AC can be inverted to DC very easily with off the shelve existing inverters that convert AC to DC. Special inverters can be designed very easily by an Electrical Engineer to fit the Tesla’s needs. I Have worked with Electro-mechanical devises for years and have worked with many inverters, and know how easy this problem is solved. If in fact the cars will charge much quicker with DC, that is the answer.
rw
Brian H. Good catch. That is exactly what I would have expected. I was actually wondering why those heavy duty trucks are not electric already, but I guess I was just ahead of time, and EV is now expanding to there too. Soon ICE is obsolete.
hmmm….
From fact sheet of that truck:
Energy usage: 2kW/mile (I assume at 40mph). Fully loaded range is 30 miles. 60kWh battery pack.
It doesn’t look like they are using lithium batteries. Roadster battery pack, even double-size one, would be only tiny fraction of that truck battery containers. I bet modern tech would give quite a bit better figures (but also cost a bit more, total truck cost is about $200k now Roadster battery pack would increase it approx 10%).
That 2kW/mile energy usage was a bit surprise to me. Roadster uses at that same speed 175Wh. That means energy usage is 11.4 times Roadster usage. Even with brick-like aerodynamics it is still very high number, so most must come from rolling resistances and it must be for fully loaded truck. I wonder if that figure is something that could be reduced. Better tires to both container and truck itself maybe.
I love reading MIT papers: www.ieeeusa.org/policy/phev/presentations/Panel%203%20Sadoway.pdf
Possible increase from 140 Whr/kg to 700 Whr/kg…. tack on the nano research claiming a 10x increase and that goes up to 7000 Whr/kg. A whopping 50x increase from the combined technologies. Imagine your current 2-hour laptop battery being replaced with an equivalent sized 100-hour battery…. or being reduced to 1/10th current size for a 10-hour battery.
All that might only be in the lab currently but the potential is that one day we may see a battery the size of the one in the Tesla storing enough electricity to power a home that averages 800 KwHrs usage per month for 3 months. Now, if only the solar cell technology would see a breakthrough that would increase their efficiency from 16-18% to at least 50%.
Roger S, there are solar cells that reach over 30% efficiency, but they are way too expensive. We don’t actually need higher efficiency IE. better output / square meter, we need cheaper tech IE better output / money spent.
I know at least two companies that have developed a way to mass-produce solar cells with tiny fraction of those high efficiency solar cell price. If you can get 10x more surface covered with 1/3 of the efficiency you are in winning side.
I think future is geothermal and solar combined and solar in more distant future will be space-mounted. Geothermal could be useful even here in Finland where we have one of the thickest mantle of the Earth, and in many places it would be much easier. The closer the surface magma is the easier it is to retrieve that energy using heat pumps (like in fridge). You have few nice places in US, like Yellowstone park which is basically a huge dormant volcano. You don’t need caldera to produce energy from geothermal heat though, all you need is a deep hole in a ground which creates temperature difference between surface and bottom of the hole. That can be converted into electricity. Sounds simple doesn’t it? Good thing in that is that it is simple. Only challenging part is to figure out how to drill deep enough holes.
I love Tesla and what they are doing, but you keep reiterating a false statement in saying that “Tesla is the only car company with a highway capable fully electric car that people can actually buy.” Think motors out of Norway also has a highway capable fully electric car that people (though European) can actually buy. Granted, the Think City has no where near the speed, power, or range of the Roadster, but at a maximum speed of 62 MPH, you could drive one on the highway, though you might have to stay in the slow lane. Just wanted to comment that you are engaging in a little bit of false advertising with that statement I see in pretty much all of Tesla’s press releases.
Do you have a dealership network setup for Canada? I am really intrigued by the opportunity for the Canadian market place, please forward me any information you may have on regional franchising opportunities.
I found a quote at www.thedailygreeen./living-green/blogs/cars-transportation/tesla-model-s-460409#comments that answered the question about what Mr Musk was going to say before being interrupted by Letterman.
“At one point he interrupted an important point (Musk was going to say that the lifetime ownership of a battery car like the Model S is low compared to conventional vehicles), but Letterman interrupted him with a broad joke about getting “shocked” by the car.”
I think that as the technology for batteries improves and the cost to performance ratio improves, people will be able to upgrade their cars’ battery packs if they want to. I don’t see it as a disadvantage to the early adopters; I see them taking responsibility over their choices as consumers and as a supportive boost for an innovative and forward looking company. Tesla deserves the backing of the public and government because they are putting out a viable and valuable product. They are also pushing to make it even more available and affordable for others in the future. What are the statistics of the other companies with the vast resources available to them? Stunted technologies (hybrids) and products that continue to be abusive to the environment. That says it all.
CM :- You are right that moving magnets will not generate electricity, But we use this spinning force to generate electricity. Please forgive me for not giving a full picture of our finding and invention as it is still at an initail stage and we would not want to disclose too much information. What I would like to say that we can use magnet to generate electricty just like fuel. It would be wonderful if one day, cars are operated by using magnetic force.
You are welcome to find out more if you would like to invest or sponsor our research.
Timo: Same components that run Tesla Roadster could run 18-wheeler truck without any difficulties, just shorter distance.
Pure electric buses are impossible due to too short range and reduced passenger capacity.