|
Backgrounder: My day job is running a space transportation company called SpaceX, but on the side I am the chairman of Tesla Motors and help formulate the business and product strategy with Martin and the rest of the team. I have also been Tesla Motor’s primary funding source from when the company was just three people and a business plan.
As you know, the initial product of Tesla Motors is a high performance electric sports car called the Tesla Roadster. However, some readers may not be aware of the fact that our long term plan is to build a wide range of models, including affordably priced family cars. This is because the overarching purpose of Tesla Motors (and the reason I am funding the company) is to help expedite the move from a mine-and-burn hydrocarbon economy towards a solar electric economy, which I believe to be the primary, but not exclusive, sustainable solution.
Critical to making that happen is an electric car without compromises, which is why the Tesla Roadster is designed to beat a gasoline sports car like a Porsche or Ferrari in a head to head showdown. Then, over and above that fact, it has twice the energy efficiency of a Prius. Even so, some may question whether this actually does any good for the world. Are we really in need of another high performance sports car? Will it actually make a difference to global carbon emissions?
Well, the answers are no and not much. However, that misses the point, unless you understand the secret master plan alluded to above. Almost any new technology initially has high unit cost before it can be optimized and this is no less true for electric cars. The strategy of Tesla is to enter at the high end of the market, where customers are prepared to pay a premium, and then drive down market as fast as possible to higher unit volume and lower prices with each successive model.
Without giving away too much, I can say that the second model will be a sporty four door family car at roughly half the $89k price point of the Tesla Roadster and the third model will be even more affordable. In keeping with a fast growing technology company, all free cash flow is plowed back into R&D to drive down the costs and bring the follow on products to market as fast as possible. When someone buys the Tesla Roadster sports car, they are actually helping pay for development of the low cost family car.
Now I’d like to address two repeated arguments against electric vehicles — battery disposal and power plant emissions. The answer to the first is short and simple, the second requires a bit of math:
Batteries that are not toxic to the environment!
I wouldn’t recommend them as a dessert topping, but the Tesla Motors Lithium-Ion cells are not classified as hazardous and are landfill safe. However, dumping them in the trash would be throwing money away, since the battery pack can be sold to recycling companies (unsubsidized) at the end of its greater than 100,000-mile design life. Moreover, the battery isn’t dead at that point, it just has less range.
Power Plant Emissions aka “The Long Tailpipe”
(For a more detailed version of this argument, please see the white paper written by Martin and Marc.)
A common rebuttal to electric vehicles as a solution to carbon emissions is that they simply transfer the CO2 emissions to the power plant. The obvious counter is that one can develop grid electric power from a variety of means, many of which, like hydro, wind, geothermal, nuclear, solar, etc. involve no CO2 emissions. However, let’s assume for the moment that the electricity is generated from a hydrocarbon source like natural gas, the most popular fuel for new US power plants in recent years.
The H-System Combined Cycle Generator from General Electric is 60% efficient in turning natural gas into electricity. “Combined Cycle” is where the natural gas is burned to generate electricity and then the waste heat is used to create steam that powers a second generator. Natural gas recovery is 97.5% efficient, processing is also 97.5% efficient and then transmission efficiency over the electric grid is 92% on average. This gives us a well-to-electric-outlet efficiency of 97.5% x 97.5% x 60% x 92% = 52.5%.
Despite a body shape, tires and gearing aimed at high performance rather than peak efficiency, the Tesla Roadster requires 0.4 MJ per kilometer or, stated another way, will travel 2.53 km per mega-joule of electricity. The full cycle charge and discharge efficiency of the Tesla Roadster is 86%, which means that for every 100 MJ of electricity used to charge the battery, about 86 MJ reaches the motor.
Bringing the math together, we get the final figure of merit of 2.53 km/MJ x 86% x 52.5% = 1.14 km/MJ. Let’s compare that to the Prius and a few other options normally considered energy efficient.
The fully considered well-to-wheel efficiency of a gasoline powered car is equal to the energy content of gasoline (34.3 MJ/liter) minus the refinement & transportation losses (18.3%), multiplied by the miles per gallon or km per liter. The Prius at an EPA rated 55 mpg therefore has an energy efficiency of 0.56 km/MJ. This is actually an excellent number compared with a “normal” car like the Toyota Camry at 0.28 km/MJ.
Note the term hybrid as applied to cars currently on the road is a misnomer. They are really just gasoline powered cars with a little battery assistance and, unless you are one of the handful who have an aftermarket hack, the little battery has to be charged from the gasoline engine. Therefore, they can be considered simply as slightly more efficient gasoline powered cars. If the EPA certified mileage is 55 mpg, then it is indistinguishable from a non-hybrid that achieves 55 mpg. As a friend of mine says, a world 100% full of Prius drivers is still 100% addicted to oil.
The CO2 content of any given source fuel is well understood. Natural gas is 14.4 grams of carbon per mega-joule and oil is 19.9 grams of carbon per mega-joule. Applying those carbon content levels to the vehicle efficiencies, including as a reference the Honda combusted natural gas and Honda fuel cell natural gas vehicles, the hands down winner is pure electric:
| Car | Energy Source | CO2 Content | Efficiency | CO2 Emissions |
| Honda CNG | Natural Gas | 14.4 g/MJ | 0.32 km/MJ | 45.0 g/km |
| Honda FCX | Nat Gas-Fuel Cell | 14.4 g/MJ | 0.35 km/MJ | 41.1 g/km |
| Toyota Prius | Oil | 19.9 g/MJ | 0.56 km/MJ | 35.8 g/km |
| Tesla Roadster | Nat Gas-Electric | 14.4 g/MJ | 1.14 km/MJ | 12.6 g/km |
The Tesla Roadster still wins by a hefty margin if you assume the average CO2 per joule of US power production. The higher CO2 content of coal compared to natural gas is offset by the negligible CO2 content of hydro, nuclear, geothermal, wind, solar, etc. The exact power production mixture varies from one part of the country to another and is changing over time, so natural gas is used here as a fixed yardstick.
Becoming Energy Positive
I should mention that Tesla Motors will be co-marketing sustainable energy products from other companies along with the car. For example, among other choices, we will be offering a modestly sized and priced solar panel from SolarCity, a photovoltaics company (where I am also the principal financier). This system can be installed on your roof in an out of the way location, because of its small size, or set up as a carport and will generate about 50 miles per day of electricity.
If you travel less than 350 miles per week, you will therefore be “energy positive” with respect to your personal transportation. This is a step beyond conserving or even nullifying your use of energy for transport – you will actually be putting more energy back into the system than you consume in transportation!
So, in short, the master plan is:
- Build sports car
- Use that money to build an affordable car
- Use that money to build an even more affordable car
- While doing above, also provide zero emission electric power generation options
Don’t tell anyone.
In a future posting: Ethanol, Ethanol Everywhere, Nor Any Drop to Drink
Posted in the categories: Company, First Post, Environment, Energy Efficiency







Welcome to the blogosphere! I’ve been tremendously impressed with what I’ve read and seen of the Tesla Roadster — I’ve yet to see anything but positive reviews from the critics who’ve had a chance to take a ride. I wish I could afford one…
A friend of mine said that his concern about Li-Ion batteries related to the combustibility of some models. If you could address those concerns, and perhaps add the explanation to the FAQ, that would be much appreciated.
Thanks for being so transparent. Now I wonder what the styling direction will be for the sedan? Will it be the blocky look of a Chrysler 300 or sleek like a the Mercedes sports sedan? Will the cars have a family resemblence like VW, Audi and BMW or will each model look unique? Developing a family resemblence is not easy. Look how long it has take Lexus and they are still shedding the Mercedes and Toyota blend look.
I hope you hire some top talent who have work for German companies which always have great design. This wil be just as important to developing a real Automobile company as the mechanicals! Too bad we will probably have to wait five years.
Excellent explanation of benefits of all-electric car. I particularly like the idea of partnering with SolarCity to provide a source of electricity to charge the car.
Roadster sounds great. To help me convince my wife to buy one too, please make the top retractable like a Mercedes SLK55.
Okay, I want one. Two questions. 1) What does it sound like (both inside and outside)? and 2) When can I get the off-road version?
Thanks. I think it’s great.
Chuck
This is the best thing I’ve ever seen. How soon until I can get the 4 door version with a solar option?
Could you comment on your expectations for the future models’ battery technologies or charging improvements? Tantilizing snippets of research indicate higher energy densities matched with higher safety are commercially possible in the short-term (e.g. Li-Poly vs. the original Li-Ion), as well as extended longevity and the potential to superfast-charge a battery (e.g. the nanotube capacitors in research at MIT and Cambridge). Do you forsee another reasonable jump in this technology for your Model 2 and/or Model 3 vehicles?
I wish there were a way to turn the clock ahead a couple years. I can’t stand the wait. I’ll be saving my money for the third model.
I think your roadster looks perfect as-is and if you made a sedan my favorite sedan is either an old Lincoln Continental or a 2006 Lexus LS. Any word on how much a Tesla sedan would cost in eight years? I wouldreally like to know anything you could tell me about a Tesla sedan, thanks
Great work! just two quick questions:
I have not heard discussion of a tesla engine for semi-trucks. As I understand ‘electric motors’ (losely used, I’d rather avoid technical aspects like drive train, etc etc), the larger they are and the more power they involve, the more effecient they are. It would seem that a semi would be the ideal product for Tesla, since a semi requires a large engine (which would allow an electric motor to be most effective) and also has the available space for large batteries (or large amounts of not-so-large batteries). Could you please clarify?
Also
It appears that you folks are not publicly traded, nor do you offer investment opportunities. Any plans to change that? I suspect there are others, like myself, who would like to put our money where our mouths are concerning this type of technology.
Thank you.
this is what people have been waiting for!
If this technology can be produced in a sporty line of hatch backs, sedans & SUV’s that run about 20 - 30 k, tesla can make serious automotive history ( Plus $).
I know a number of people, including myself, that would love to help with the development of this kind of technology, but can’t afford the price tag of $89k. What kind of investment opportunities are going to be available in Tesla? I’d like to know how I can help you develop that “low cost family car” even though I can’t afford the Roadster.
This electric car is perfect. Keep on the current business track and Tesla Motors will be the number one auto company in the world. The styling is impressive and I really see a huge market for these vehicles. I predict that the vehicles will be popular with all age groups. I only wish that a few different models of Tesla Motors electric vehicles will be ready to sell to the public within 3 years. Please keep the same styling as the roadster as the vehicles will be a great success. I also predict that Tesla Motors will be the top car company within the next 7 years. Keep up the good work.
I learned about you guys through Morford’s blab in the chron. He is actually pretty good. I checked you guys our and when I called my wife over to see the car she said ” An electric car, that’s bullhalibut, I bet it’s ugly like those japanese things” Needless to say it is from ugly. I love the idea of going for the hot hi ender. My buddy just bought a prius - he’s a chemistry proff at UC. Young testosterone driven Wall Streeters, entrepeuners aren’t going to go Prius.. but they will buy what you are selling. Whatever you do make the design absolutely spot on. You screw that up you’re in trouble. I don’t know who did your current one but it looks great. I’d like to see one on the street.
Best of luck.
I would urge the team at Tesla Motors to be very careful with this technology. There is a reason why General Motors, Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, etc do not have electric cars on the market. There is great demand for this type of vehicle, but your greatest enemy to success is the Government of the United States, which is controlled by big oil. To ensure the success of your technology please limit the patents, which are submitted to the patent office. The patent office has oversight by the DOE - Department of Oil Executives - Department of Energy. Be very careful of patent suppression, which will result in lengthy Federal Prison terms if technology is disclosed. Your protection and that of your technology is the full release of details via the internet. Share everything and encourage multiple company fabrication plants all over the world. Tesla Motors will not loose market share, because only a few companies will have the financing and organization to succeed.
The danger will become more accute when mass production nears of family vehicles. DO NOT EXPECT BIG OIL TO SIT STILL. DO NOT EXPECT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO SIT STILL. Take this warning very seriously.
Encourage fabrication of your engines and storage cells for electric car conversion, as your company moves towards producing its own family vehicles. Operate satallite factories as clandestine operations. Immediately remove the names of all company employees from your web site. This is for your protection and theirs. I may sound paranoid, but from what I’ve read I have good reason to be.
I love your car. I love your technology. Your electric car concept must succeed to stop the carnage in the Middle East and provide people everywhere with clearner air. But realize that your company is at war with another agenda in the Whitehouse. That agenda is the control of oil to be sold as a transportation fuel by big oil companies. The sale of gasoline is a huge source of tax revenue for the government and road infrastructure work. Hence the conflict. Government may pretend they want electric vehicles, but look more towards their actions.
Alternative Energy Suppression: www.byronwine.com/
Suppression at its best: www.sonyclassics.com/whokilledtheelectriccar/
Water Fuel Cell: www.waterfuelcell.org/
Stanley Meyer died trying to save oil - Do not make the same mistakes he did. Do not involve government in any way. Do not involve the patent office. Do not involve the DOE - Department of Oil Executives - Department of Energy. They are your enemy.
Alternative news: www.rense.com/
www.whatreallyhappened.com/
Do not misinterpret this blog. I want your technology to succeed. Please, just be very careful and understand who your technology threatens and the profits which will be lost if it succeeds.
Thanks for the color on the solar option. I’ve followed your work at SpaceX, wasn’t aware of SolarCity. I had been assuming the solar option was with one of the companies the google guys were invested in.
If the roadster winds up at $89k, then the 100k signature with the extra options doesn’t sound like such a bad deal, really. Relatively speaking, at least ;^/
Still curious regarding calendar life on the pack.
Another plee to have you guys talk about battery technology. I have seen many blog postings here from people asking about Ultracapacitors and new Li-Ion variants. Have you looked at all of them? Can you talk more about what you are planning first, and what might be coming?
I’m in love already. What a a gorgeous machine and amazingly innovative concept.
Nikola Tesla is someone I’ve become accquainted with only recently but I think he would be proud of your efforts so far. Here’s to praying for winning the lottery! Hurry with the more affordable versions…..
Also have to agree with David in Chicago. Tesla Motors will rule the automotive world if you stick to your plan. Imagine the US without forgeign oil dependence…imagine the possiblity of peace without wars over oil control….
Keep it up. Can’t wait to see them on the road!
Mr. Musk,
Thank you for your extraordinary contributions to mankind. You are a man of remarkable vision and a true catalyst for life. I wish you great success in all of your endevors.
awesome but I haven’t seen any specs on interior dimensions… are they available ? do you have to be a jockey to get in it?
Thanks Elon, your efforts are greatly appreciated. I wish you much success.
Sam
I love this blog and I’m enjoying the current trend of environmentally concious companies such as yourselves and, in the UK, Innocent (who make smoothies - perhaps you should team up?).
I’m saving up for my Tesla, though I suspect I won’t be the first one in the UK to get one.
Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the very substantial explanation.
I am really looking forward to see (and feel) the Tesla on the road.
Good luck and best wishes
from Germany
Please let me know you are going public with your company. Will you trade on the stock market board.
Thanks
Michael
I love the concept as a R&D person I do have two comments;
1. there is some Research and development of flexable type poloar pannels I look at this and I see a car like the telsa Painted in this type material. have you seen this or is there plans?
2. In the mean time how about a small diesel generator for those long PCH trips
I like the sports car angle here, hoping the price will be around $50-60,000, that way US auto makers can finally push away the foreign oil and start with the cleaner, cheaper.
The look is awesome! Kudo’s to your Product Designers!!!
Are you developing a mini-van version? I will help in design for free…or set me up with one if you feel it neccassary to compensate for design time.
With that sort of acceleration and maintained speed, did you ever think of putting wings and a propeller on the car? Also, to extend the range of the Lithium-ion battery, I would suggest a double layered electrolytic capacitor or an aerogel capacitor in the circuit along with a strong magnetic continuously rotated through an induction coil to maintain a charge in the capacitor and battery. You might even be able to reduce the weight and size of the battery if this was applied to the car’s circuitry. Of course, the next step towards the most efficient propulsion is electrogravitics, but you need an energy source that can produce millions of volts continously. Of course, if you achieved that, then you would have to reconfigure the style of the Tesla sportscar to look like the Area 51 sports model!!!! Just my thoughts to share.
FYI I read about you in the International Herald Trib. while sipping on a barely passable espresso in Tokyo last week, so word is obviously spreading far and wide. Advise if you have any interest in Canadian distribution. I was selling Honda products when they first introduced the N600 and S600 30 years ago, and recognized a winner about to emerge at that point in time. I have just discovered the next gem.
All the best.
Learned about the Tesla in The Wall Street Journal 7-27-2006 edition and have been interested ever since. No direct dependance on OIL!! Excellent pursuit. Would be interested in learning more about how someone could support you and your company by other than a purchasing plan. I believe electric/solar is truly the best direction for autos and it appears you have figured it out! Nice looking design too. Please consider an automatic roof, AC and perhaps an on board reserve battery pack. Zero to 60 in about 4 seconds, I imagine those other overpriced sport cars companies are feeling a little silly now
.
Thank you and don’t look back.
I need more videos to watch and see and imagine on this website, the body style, the frame, the motor, the sit down look from the steering wheel driving on a track. You know, the cool stuff.
I hope your 4 door version carries forward the look of the Roadster and takes the form of a hatchback. I love the looks of the Roadster, but since I know I can’t afford one, I’ll begin getting my hopes up that the 4 door will be able to replace my small SUV. After getting so excited about the Roadster, I’m ready to put my name on the waiting list to purchase the 4 door!
Anxiously waiting
My complete dream vehicle:
After seeing the Laremo specs, including the safety oriented body shell design,
they prove that 20 hp diesel is enough to propel a 1000 lb vehicle and get 157 mpg.
My idea is for a much smaller format.
That being said, the average commuter really needs a 2-3 person vehicle,
possibly in a 3 wheel motorcycle platform, that can top end at 75mph.
Design aspects would be geared to a quick fold system
for limited footprint when parked or charging.
My complete dream vehicle would also be to also be setup
in a Delta (1 wheel in front) three wheel tilting platform
(similar to the Carver 3 wheel tilter),
with individual electric motors on each rear wheel.
The overall weight would be in the 500-700 lb range,
to keep it pushable in case of any malfunction.
While regenerative braking is great, some kind of spring loaded system
from braking for initial off line boost would also be efficient.
Would love to be able to get a Retrofit type of unit,
to give older cars a new life, which will be good advertising.
I think I have given away too much.
(machinist with 20+ years exp.)
Am I hired as a designer?
Any *approximate* idea when the mentioned “half-the-price family car” will be available? $90K kinda stretches my budget thin, but $50K sounds much more plausible =^.^=
Read about the car in Wired…great mag.
Wondering if the roadster as it ages, is designed to accommodate updated battery technology? What is the mftr warranty on the current model?
What kind of relationships are you looking for when establishing car dealerships? Will you create independents - meaning they will only sell Tesla? (Which I think would be a fantastic idea!) THat helps with the branding.
I am excited about your company product and mission. I raise a glass to your success. Look forward to being a future owner of Tesla in both stock and rubber!
looks great. sounds great. hope it provides everything as promised. looks like a nice little roadster marketed to compete with all the solstice, elise, mx-5 etc etc. hope its priced as competitively as well. keep up the good work guys cant wait to see the finished product out on the road.
I just wanted to let you know that I appreciate your efforts, and that our family will strongly consider buying an electric car if it gets into the $30K range.
Keep up the good work!
Nice breakdown of the math. How does biodiesel fit into all of this? Particularly, if you can ‘upcycle’ Waste Vegetable Oil in a Cradle-to-Cradle kind of philosophy. That’s another point… any influence from McDonough and Braungart at Tesla Motors or SolarCity?
It’s awesome that Tesla is not aiming to be just a niche player selling exotic sports car but wants to really change the whole market by aiming at the mainstream. Best of luck! I can’t wait to see the more affordable versions.. Hopefully they’ll look good. Something like the Mazda 3 or the new Civic would be perfect.
Don’t let the oil/energy/auto corporations buy you out. Stay true to your vision and you will surpass all of them in a very short time. Plus you will be able to sleep at night, and so will I when I buy one. The day you have a sedan available, I’m buying. I don’t care how much it costs, either. I now spend 330.00/month in gas. If I add that to my current 500.00 car payment, I can afford an 80,000.00 car which will be way cooler, faster, and greener than my current car.
It would be worth trying to get this car on Oprah - give a few Roadsters away to the call-in audience. The number to call-in would only be a available from this website during the show. Include the SolarCity info and a plug for the Cris Paine Movie. Include the other quick electric cars too - ie: t-zero, Fetish, Wrightspeed… It would make a great episode! Especially if you were going to do a stock offering.
Ever since the unveiling of AC Propulsions’ Tzero (a very similar car, though much less refined and without a business plan) I’ve been planning to build such a car myself. I was very excited to finally find the truth behind those “Lotus is building an EV” rumours. Kudos!
The excitement Tesla Motors have wipped up is heartwarming; there is hope yet for a saner world.
Will the future also unveal an all-wheel drive Tesla?
This is FANTASTIC, but unlike a previous post that read “this is what everyone is waiting for”, this isn’t quite it. Don’t get me wrong…FANTASTIC… I’d love one, but…….
Here’s the catch…most people can afford a car…they often can’t afford a second one, or a play one that is limited. If you want to build the ULTIMATE car, build an electric car with a hybrid motor that can be switched off. If I could do my daily commute all in electric, but switch to oil only when I wanted to do a road trip, it would be the perfect vehicle. I’d even come up with $80-90K for it, as I wouldn’t have to spend any on gas or a second vehicle. I’m sure this is an easy request
In the meantime… I’ll be saving my $$$’s to be able to get one of these beautiful pieces of engineering. Kudo’s
Sounds just great, but, I can see myself driving from San Francisco to LA stopping off overnight in Bakersfield while the battery charges. What was once a 7 hour trip is now a 15 hour trip. Get real, for this modified golf car to exist in the real world and compete against real cars that can go across country in 3 1/2 days there is a long way to go. You are correct about most people needing a car with a range of 250 miles, but longer ranges would require a hydrocarbon powered machine. I can only affort one car .But I guess at the price of $80 K a person would use the Tesla as a rich boy toy. Most people who need transportation buy cars in the $15K - $25K range. Bring the price down, make a family sedan, increase the range with less than 30 minutes charge and it becomes a practical machine. These glorified golf carts have been around for years, you’ve just put in a slightly better battery.
So how about a little fun fund raising? See if your neighbor George Lucas—who LOVES fast cars and TECH/Future would like to make a DVD about the Tesla. It would be a great story and an excellent marketing device.
The DVD could be in HD (IMAX–also) and have both the story of the “tesla pioneers” and crews as well as show casing all the info that everybody keeps asking about in these posts. Racing against other rods—Battery Charging—Endurance Drives (city/highway)—Drives with Famous Celebrities—cool compairisons to Oil, hybreds and how our cities and lives would change with this type of car.
Sell the DVD’s for $9.99 or more! and make $$$$$$$$ to get that sedan build sooner.
There seems to be some interest in public investment in your company. Several posters have mentioned it. Would you consider doing a Direct Public Offering instead of the usual investment banker IPO. SEC Rule 504 allow a no file, no limitation, Direct Public Offering but is limited to $1M. However, there are other types of direct public offerings that allow higher investment levels, SB-1 and SB-2 to name a few. However they also requre more filing requirements - You can still go direct to the public. The key here is DIRECT.
The average person never gets a chance to give their investment dollars directly to a company’s tresury. They only have a chance to buy on the secondary market paying a wealthy primary investor for thier shares. Doing a Direct Public Offering would allow you to corral your base now and capture them as loyal future customers. These people can’t afford a $100K depreciated asset. However, they have some disposable income and might buy a $30 to $38K luxury sedan. These investors would be much more likely to buy
a $45-50K electric sedan knowing that they are helping a company that they own.
I’d be willing to put in $1, $5K or maybe $10K. I’d also think about the $45K 4-door. However, since $45K is still a bit high for a typical
car I’d be much more willing to purchase one if I had a stake in the company’s future.
“The strategy of Tesla is to enter at the high end of the market, where customers are prepared to pay a premium, and then drive down market as fast as possible to higher unit volume and lower prices with each successive model.”
Your strategy is revolutionary! This goes against Clayton’s theory of Disruptive Technology that basically says tech that kills big companies moves upstream not downstream…
Who has a better chance of the $10,000 no compromise family car?
A Tata like electricmaker that works from the $2,000 car upstream or the $100,000 car that works to cut $90,000 off the price.
It looks like a cool car. I wish you great success with it. Now to avoid buying too many gas-burners before you build one in my price range…
I wrote about you guys a short while ago and would love a drive.
http://postmanpatel.blogspot.com/2006/06/tesla-car-with-electric-performance.html
US is a big country , why do you need to go to UK to design / make the 2 models yuo have ?
A motor car company that outsources from the get go !
Why the hell can’t I be this smart?
One question: They are now developing what are basically plastic solar cells. Can this plastic be used in the family car that is being developed so that the whole exterior of the car is actually a giant solar panel? This would also extend it’s mileage since it would be converting sunlight into energy while on the road.
Is this possible, or not quite yet technically?
Jason Trout
Read your white paper as well as your other press. Your solar panel idea will probably only fly with your highest end customers. Using your vehicle efficiency of 2.18 km/MJ, 50 miles a day would require 10.25 kWh/day…. which, depending on the location of the roof, would require a 3-6kW solar system = extra $30-60,000 (hopefully the solar tax credits in California will help the economics a bit).
A more affordable option (though currently less lucrative for you) would be spend $2-4/month on green tags such and the wind energy credits offered by Native Power: www.nativeenergy.com/coolwatts.html. Maybe you could team up with an organization like them and offer credits straight through the dealership. Especially so the more budget buyers of your 2nd and 3rd gen cars can afford to have a truly carbon free car too.
Best of luck.
So, in short, the master plan is., ISO, i
1 Build sports cars 3% of the Nation
2 Use that money to build an affordable car 7% of the nation
3 Use that Money to build an even more affordable car 90% of the nation.
4 While doing above, also provide zero emission electric power generation options.
Wow!! Great Idea But how did you Guys get start up Doe??
When Ford started in the 19 Hundreds, He wanted to put the little guy first in a car, Then came the luxury Cars.
The same with Volkswagen
In the little City I live in in Florida, We have 16 City inspectors That drive an average of 170 miles a day each.
Just think if you had that Even More Affordable Car , Yeah know the one for 90% of the nation you would have sold 17 already.
Thanks
Michael Clark
Well I was wondering why restrict this kind of technology to the market of luxury sport cars, when you could easily market it to all kinds of cars. I mean Toyota and Honda are making a killing with their hybrids, and your specs seam to be superior. The Tesla Roadster seam to be able to compete with any kind of car in their specs, but it boils down to money, is it cheaper to drive a gasoline driven sport car of the same price/spec range than Tesla Roadster or a the Roadster? It would be really funny if it would be cheaper to charge your car by feeding gas to an electric generator, than to plugging it to the wall.
“However, let’s assume for the moment that the electricity is generated from a hydrocarbon source like natural gas, the most popular fuel for new US power plants in recent years.”
Unfortunately over 50% of the electricity in the US is currently generated by burning coal.* What would the math be like with coal?
* Source: www.netl.doe.gov National Energy Technology Laboratory
Perfect concept and great plan!
I am guessing that your initial production will be limited until the sales of the higher priced roadster gives you the funds to expand production.
By the time the lower priced cars are designed the funds from the sale of the high end cars will allow you to support a larger production base.
My suggestion, when you are ready to expand production, look into the Ford plant in MN. It is closing in the next year or so. I am betting you could get a good deal from the state of Minnesota considering the number of jobs you would bring in.
The range is perfect. Sure, it won’t work for everyone, but it will work for the majority.
Best wishes, thank you for the revolutionary conept!
While being employed at a large electric company for 35 years, I had the opportunity to drive many, so-called, electric cars that gave dismal performance and dependability. Never thought I would see, in my lifetime, a smart, dependable, viable EV! Conversely, my mind has changed with the introduction of the Tesla. However, it looks like those of us who live in middle America are out of luck for a long time. I would be very interested in your future, family car, but a $10,000 service premium (approx. 25-30% of the purchase price) would be very cost prohibitive to all but the very richest of us. As we live about 600 miles from what will be the nearest Tesla sales point, it would seem that a more fair service charge would be to involve some type of sliding, proximity service fee. Additionally, although very impressive, a 250 mile range would still not qualify this vehicle as a primary family car. A typical, 600 mile, family day trip in an oil based vehicle would translate into a better than two day trip in the Tesla. However, I would expect the range of the Tesla to improve by the time that the family version is produced. Congratulations on what I feel is finally a viable EV vehicle that can be used for current, in-state travel. I would be interested if, and when, you become publicly traded.
Comments in response to other blog postings:
Solar cells on the car wouldn’t get you too much. They would look a bit ugly, and there isn’t enough surface area to get much charge in the batteries even if you parked it in the sun all day. The idea of putting them on your roof at home, and sharing with the grid that charges your car is much more practical.
In terms of driving the car SF to LA or some other > 250mile road trip:
#1: Tesla could consider a gas generator trailer like some other electric car companies did. Basically if you had to extend the range you can generate electricity as you go in a small trailer you pull behind the car. It could burn LPG, CNG, BioDiesel or whatever was your best alternative.
#2: Quick charge batteries are having some breakthroughs. Maybe the future will have a quick charge station at a nice restaurant in San Luis Obipso so you can get charged back up while having lunch?
will this Lithium battery have problems like the cell phone or the pocket pcs where their battery capacity keeps dropping after a number of recharges to ultimately that it is not rechargeable at all?
Superconducting Motor Technology
Superconducting motors are new types of AC synchronous motors that employ HTS (high temperature superconductor) windings in place of conventional copper coils. Because HTS wire can carry significantly larger currents than can copper wire, these windings are capable of generating much more powerful magnetic fields in a given volume of space.
Advances in coil design make it possible for a superconducting machine to match the power output of an equally rated conventional motor with as little as one-third the size and weight.
www.amsuper.com/products/motorsGenerators/index.cfm
It is very good to see a company put together a combination of “old principles ” to develop a new product needed by the people who drive cars. After the way American automobile manufacturers have put out many pieces of “junk” over the years, one would be hard pressed to have a sincere car producer to put out a product which didn’t cost the consumers more than they could save.
Are there any new patents applied for on the “Tesla”?
I tend to agree with: ———- “Reid Vinette wrote on August 2nd, 2006 at 11:35 pm
I would urge the team at Tesla Motors to be very careful with this technology. There is a reason why General Motors, Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, etc do not have electric cars on the market. There is great demand for this type of vehicle, but your greatest enemy to success is the Government of the United States, which is controlled by big oil. To ensure the success of your technology please limit the patents, which are submitted to the patent office”————
Whether it is the H-2 fuel cell, Bio-diesel, ethanol F-85, gasoline, propane, or batteries there will be a competative fight to convince the car buyers that “their” product is the one that should be brought.
The car and energy producers appear to be “jockeying” together to insure their market share as the change over to the new energies takes place and are brought into a controlled market.
“Big energy businesses” are out for themselves……
They will drag their feet, or speed up a process only when it comes to maintaining control, with the maximum profit.
It is debatable as to whether America is leading the way in fuel cell development or other methods of developing getting the mass production of a complete system with the means of using alternative energies.
My question is: Where is the testing and development actually being done in the development of alternative fuels? Are we sending our Government funded development programs outside of this country?
Who is to blame for the continued “run around” on not actually having a finished product which can be mass produced? The hydrogen fuel cell is not a new idea which has just happened for the principle/theory has been here for many years and the business world has had their opportunity to develop alternative energy and the methods of transforming that energy.
It would appear the the “Tesla system” could use the H-2 cell for extending the range.
Here is a Tesla competitor (although more expensive, and ugly by comparison):
www.hybridtechnologies.com/media.php?mediaID=060212
Here is an article talking about Li-Ion battery safety in cars with quotes from Martin Eberhard:
www.technologyreview.com/printer_friendly_article.aspx?id=17250
This is a great car, yet the $89,000. price tag may be out of the affordability range of many people.
I guess it is mostly the 6,831 lithium-ion batteries that make up such a costly price?
A Toyota Prius is only something like $21,725.., and it is equipped with Double systems - oil engine+electric motor/battery(Ni-MH).
Wouldn’t it be a good idea to make the quantities of batteries optional?
1/4 of the range, 60 miles, would be enough for everyday in-city use and also fits in with the solar-panel capacity.
if you offer a Tesla roadster with 6831/4=1708 batteries, wouldn’t the price be something like $37,250.? (Let’s assume the car without any batteries costs $20,000.)
and, in a further option, if the buyer choose not to use the expensive Lithium-ion battery and adpot the cheaper Ni-MH battery(used in the Prius), wouldn’t the price be reduced to near that of the Prius?
Furthermore, you can build a removable backup oil-tank and a (also removable and optional) small intelligent / well silenced generator into the space left out by the 5123 batteries.
You can build a automatic recharge mechanism to take back the down-hill and braking energy? (like the Toyota Prius)
In this way, the Tesla-minor will turn into a Linear Hybrid, which is better than the Prius idea - Bilateral Hybrid, I do think the set of oil engine(Prius) is kind of a waste of money and adds extra weight to the car.
Eldon Musk, I enjoyed reading The Secret Tesla Motors Master Plan, and I wish you and your team great success. But I am amazed that neither you nor Martin, have not published results of on-road tests on the Tesla’s Li-Ion battery pack. Your claim of 250 mile range, what is that based on. Is it based on continuous freeway driving at 60 mph, or stop-n-go city driving etc? Have you completed on-road test of the battery in High ambient temp. as in Phoenix July-Aug weather. Cold ambient temp. as in Chicago Jan-Feb weather. On-road vibration, pothole test. Have you tested to end-of-cycle-life of battery? Show us the results. Remember GM, Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, all failed with their EV’s, because of battery packs that had inadequate performance. Their battery chemistry’s, included PbA, NiMh, Li-Ion. What is different about your Li Ion battery that has 6341 EXTERNAL connections?
Elon,
I share your passion and anticipation of renewable energy solutions that can compete in cost with hydrocarbon fuels. The benefits for the environment are obvious, but there are so many other reasons why reducing (and eventually eliminating) our need for oil, coal, and natural gas will take America to the next level of evolution politically and as a world citizen. I commend you, Martin and the rest of the team for your efforts! And I look forward to the opportunity to purchase your sedan in 2008.
I have been following the electric automobile industry for quite some time (almost purchased a Sparrow from Corbin Motors - before they went bankrupt). I am extremely impressed with the results you’ve achieved so far . . . leveraging the former technology of Nikola Telsa is brilliant, and I’m compelled to get involved with Tesla Motors. Like you, I currently have a day job (VP technology for a national bank), but what you are doing is so important to this generation - I believe this is a once in a lifetime thing.
I will contact you via separate email with a proposal on how I could provide value - and help ensure Tesla Motors’ success.
So - when will they be available in the UK?
The concept has a lot of potential.
What about distribution in Europe?
On which automotive shows will you be
presenting this jewel?
Keep up the good work!
Just to let you know that the interest in your car extends to Australia. The price of petrol here is $1.50/L, ($5.77/gallon). We’re counting on you to spark the EV revolution. I look forward to news that you are exporting.
After reading the post by Reid Vinette, we took a vote, nutter or not. The nutters were right. Check out the story of con artist Stanley Meyer in Wikipedia for the full story. The laws of thermodynamics are pretty hard to refute.
Having said that, I’ll be first in line to see “Who killed the electric car?”. I’m trying to imagine myself as a big oil exec, reading the reviews for the Telsa Roadster and the movie reviews for “An Inconvenient Truth”. Would I be worried? For the longer term, certainly.
Here’s hoping that Moore’s law works for batteries too. (Unlike Meyer’s water fuel cell, there’s nothing in the laws of physics that says it won’t)
Cheers,
Carl (Sydney, Australia)
With such high profile and wealthy investors it’s hard to imagine that the idea of an electic car that sill some day take over and beat the Internal combustion engine will be quielty silenced by oil companies or Ford Chysler et al. i.e. you’ll be “bought out”.
I can’t see how your plan can fail. It is quite simply brilliant! Please stay the course: let the rich and famous have their $100,000 sports cars (there are certainly enough of them in California). They will be happy, great advertising and inthe long run pay for our humbler vehicles.
Don’t be swayed by some of the comments or suggestions that have been posted - well intentioned though they may be - Your marketing strategy is quite brilliant and I am following your progress on a daily basis as well as “spreading the word” as I am sure many others are doing.
Bon Chance from Canada
It looks like you hit the nail on the head!!
What are your plans for Canadian distribution? and how can I become part of it?
Demy
The Roadster looks great and who wouldn’t want to support such a clean technology? However ,being married and having two children means I will most likely have to wait for your electric sedan. I’ll be the first to purchase on as soon as it’s available.
It is intellectually dishonest to use natural gas as the model for CO2 emissions. More than half the power in the US is produced by COAL, and COAL, not natural gas, is to be the fuel of the overwhelming majority of power plants built in the US in the next 10-15 years. This is a fact given planned plants–and is widely known to people like Tesla who are in the power industry.
The “spinning” has to stop. The energy crisis is real, and the problem is that the only ones flinging the BS as much as the oil majors are the alternative energy players, who constantly hide the truth to make their “tech” look better. In Khosla’s case, as was recently proven in the Oil Drum, outright lying can be resorted to. So, take down this essay, do a study with COAL–and with coal without any pollution control given the recent grandfathering of all the old, no Pollution control mega-coal plants the Bush Admin. has allowed.
Thank you for getting this country off the big 3.
One way to help your cash flow would be to offer a Conversion Package.
This would restore life to the millions of older cars that have already been built. No safety standards have to be met… I have converted a couple cars now and I know there are thousands and thousands of do-it-yourselfers out there who would be willing to pay for the Regen capability alone. Sell conversion packages would increase your volume of the components, lowering the price faster.
Thank you anf all the best Luck.
Steve Richardson
Chris Ruppel you are correct the U.S. does generate energy from coal. There are some very obvious reasons why your concern about Tesla posting NG numbers is unsubstantiated.
The first is that the Tesla is currently being offered in California. California is NOT mostly coal, neither is Miami, coal powered.
The second is that the fastest growing segment of utility power production is natural gas as clearly stated in the white papers.
The third and most important reason to any thinking environmentalist is that because the Tesla is an electric car it can take any source of power. You can create the electricy in the very greenest way possible.
Calling Tesla liars is out of line, and in this case unfounded. They’ve got the numbers and if you don’t like them it’s easy enough to check out the numbers from the governments own white papers.
I agree 100% with Reid Vinette above. Be very careful guys and girls. Once you start really making a difference, you had better have your own private security ready to do battle. This is no joke. HUGE money and power are at stake here for players whose families have been at it for more than a century. Take some of that money that is to be put back into R&D and put it into your own armed protection force.
BTW, I want one. I live in Florida. Florida would be one of the better states to have a sales center since it is sunny and warm year ’round. I’ll help run it
…
I’ve already seen that, if one is willing to commit to the vehicle for a long enough period (e.g., 15-20 years), and can tender the high buy-in price, the Roadster promises to be as economic to own and operate over the long term as a present-day, gasoline powered family sedan, with the added benefits of being fun to drive and helping the environment. For me, it isn’t so much an issue of cost as it is an issue of capacity. In my dreams, I would love a little two-seater for fun and for my daily commute. But in reality, I have a family, which means that I need at least a sedan that carries more passengers, has a decently-sized trunk, and exhibits reasonable performance and range under full burden.
What I am saying is, if you could produce an electric sedan that does for the “family car” what the Roadster does for the sports car, it wouldn’t have to be priced at $30,000 or below to catch MY interest. I can do the math, and see that, over the long haul, the electric would be a better deal than a comparable gasoline vehicle, even priced as high as the Roadster will be at its introduction. But don’t misunderstand me. I would not be willing to pay such a high premium upfront, only to “save the environment,” much less to follow a high-tech trend. Rather, I would expect a well-built, durable vehicle that would last the 15-20 years I would need to drive it, in order to match the ownership expense of a comparable internal-combustion car. If such an electric happened to be priced at $40,000 or less, so much the better.
That’s a great plan and I wish you luck.
Anyone else see the documentary ‘Who Killed the Electric Car’? I urge all members of your company to see it. It’s not a conspiracy, it’s just common sense that any disruptive technology against locked-in industries will be met with harsh resistance. So you really need to prepare.
What should you prepare for? Well as you may know, importing electric cars into this country from Europe is ILLEGAL. If the government went so far as to outlaw possible mainstream electric cars here, I expect the government, namely the NHTSA to block your future mainstream vehicle and call it unsafe for highway, no matter how safe it is. You will be sued by companies that hold battery patents even though you own the rights to license your batteries. The oil industry will run ads in the NYT and other media slandering electric vehicle technology, as they did in the late 90s. And that’s just the start of it… I won’t even speculate any further.
Well what can you do? As a start you’re making the right decision about being open about your plans. You need to get people and consumers excited about the technology. Use the people to push your technology through any roadblocks. Post videos on Youtube and Google Videos, make a MySpace page, submit stories to digg, reach out to alternative media. Broadcast to us anytime you hit a major barrier that seems unfair or purely politically motivated. Use the power of the people. If a company takes the lead and shows a no-oil future is possible, the people will get behind it.
The old industries could spend millions even billions to stop you, but we have potentially millions even billions of people on our side. Forget the Middle East… the question if we can stop using oil in the next few decades is the real World War III. It’s the war to end all wars. If we fail all life on earth will come to an end. A mass extinction like 250 million years ago when there was so much methane in the air 95% of all life died. It could happen again.
Companies like yours can create a new future and I really hope you succeed. And hey, you could get rich doing it… so why not?
Is their a possibility of making a universal battery pack for all cars, similar to the Tyco remote control batteries, that could be removed at some sort of charging station and replaced with another one that’s fully charged?
Your claim of 250 miles to a 3.5 hour charge is obviously without running any of the amenities included in the vehicle. With much of ordinary driving being done in the cold of winter and the heat of summer, What is the range with either the heater or air conditioner running full blast? (I am assuming that other amenities power use would be negligible.)
Hi,
I wish you and your company the best. The Tesla can be the turn a round point for electric cars. Your mission is logical and will work if you follow your plan from sports car down to mass transit. I am a design engineer in the Elevator Industry and we use regen braking. All sounds so simple and you have shown the technology is nothing from NASA. All available and off the shelf. Shortly there will be many companies following your lead. Toyota, Honda, etc. Makes you think, why didn’t anyone else go up against the oil companies till now. ( Creepy ) Well you are a new hope for me against Global Warming. I can see a big change in 10 years, the gas car becoming extinct as it should have been 30 years ago.
As for the name Tesla, good choice. My idol “The Master of Lightening”. Ahead of his time. As you may prove to be shortly.
OK now a bit of tech. I wrote the Manual that explains how to convert Porsche engines to fit in the Classic VW Bug. My site www.nextgen-usa.com Which brings to mind freezing your rear off in the winter if you ever owned one. How do you intend of heating the Tesla, strictly electric power? I see mileage dropping quite rapidly, like maybe 50 to 100 mile range ( a guess ). Warm climate no problem, New York, yipes!!!
Best regards,
Joe Cali
No one has asked the biggest question of all…
Will it hold my golf clubs ??
(:^)
Seriously though, Kudos to a job well done ( so far ) I’m crossing my fingers that this dream-come-true doesn’t fizzle out before becoming a reality.
-Jim
The announcement about the tesla roadster has been buzzing in the EV lists for a few weeks now. I think you have a great plan. Your secret white paper was a refreshing read.
Even though I would like to invest in your company I see the need to keep it away from open stocks and control by less than honerable companies(che vron) like happened with N I M H batteries and the electric cars that relied on them. I wish there was another way we could could all help. Perhaps just buying the model that works for us(be it roadster or later, family sedan) is all that we can do.
I also hope you market it in north america rather than just the states!
Thanks!
Tom
Your target for the family sedan - is probably more of a luxury sedan. If its going to be 40-45k you are facing off against performance luxury sedans. BMW3 or 5 series and the like. That’s fine, take the same approach and beat them at their own game. Then you will be in a position to make the leap to a family car - a 4 door hatchback, 20-25k, sporty again, say something like a Mazda3 hatch. You can play the same platform to a sedan, and something like a Mazda5 wagon as well. Then you can follow with something sub 20k on a par with at Honda Fit or Scion.
Ok, Get back to work - we’re waiting you know.
Have u considered a bullet-proof limo version for the Prez. that he will need if his admin allows your vehicle to come to market unmolested before next presidential election? At that point in time your lovely product will be used as campaign spinning device as proof positive of Bush’s successful energy policy. Can u imagine Big Dick Cheney, Condi Rice, or Bill Hastert arriving in full photo opp splendor in their blue Tesla to debate Hillary (who of course arrived in her red Tesla)?!!!
afdcmap2.nrel.gov/locator/FindPane.asp
Use this to help gauge how far you could drive, u have to use the fuel picks to get a range circle. Tesla you could ad this or similar to your faq to get people to understand how far 250 miles can get you. It shows we don’t need fuel except for the non stop cross country trips and that could be the phev/fcev. Again it will only get better in time, never back down.
Saving for later
land of sky blue water
A small thought for your white paper, Mr. Musk,
Recharging a Tesla overnight would put demand on the electrical grid when demand is lowest, making the grid and its power sources more efficient.
Wishing you and the Tesla team the very best!
Bob Rolls
Silver Spring, Maryland
This is great stuff. I really had hoped that the Majors would follow this route on the Hybrid tip, but the push was never made.
My one concern is about the mechanical supply/support train. Where do I take a Tesla if it breaks down? Can I get spare parts at regular retail outlets? Etc…
Dear Eton,
You are absolultely correct in your emmissions calculations. It seems at first glance that you are using the Lotus Elise chassis. An excellent choice for its light weight and stiff platform. I hope to see your cars on the street soon and in a comparison test with the top gas sports cars. Instant torque always wins!
All the Best,
Gunnar Keel
Do you read this blog? Someone from Tesla Motors should regularly comment on the responses here.
There are some good ideas here, and you should at least acknowledge them, even if you don’t want to release any information.
Comments of public offerings are nice, but as a simpler plan for the time being: you could just offer a method for public donations. I’m sure many would be willing to donate small amounts. It’s as easy as PayPal. Sure, in the scheme of things, the donations may not amount to much, but at least us that cannot afford to buy one could feel proud to support your efforts.
You have the right idea: Assist the Private Funding of R&D by the (hopefully) high profit margins of the Roadster. It will generate income quickly, and help spread the word quickly.
I don’t want to come off as a conspiracy theorist like one previous poster, however, I urge you to be very careful, especially considering the current US administration and the threat you could eventually present to the US budget and those individuals who are rich and becoming richer by constantly and unmercifully overcharging us for gasoline.
Some posters are correct: there are those that cannot afford a 2nd vehicle that is their “toy”. I agree. However, most middle class families do own more than one car, and when your EV sedan comes out, those could use their other, gasoline powered, car for their long trips where they want to be able to drive more than 250 miles before charging. The rest of the time, they could use your EV sedan for the majority of their driving. It’s what I would do. It would work perfectly until there was a better way to make long trips. That said, I’m willing to bet you will attempt to, and likely succeed, in solving that problem before the family sedan is released.
In your white paper “The 21st Century Electric Car”, you state “the ‘electrical-outlet-to-wheel’ energy efficiency of the Tesla Roadster is 2.53 km/MJ x 86% = 2.18 km/MJ”. Does the 2.53km/MJ number take into account the inefficiencies in the motor, in the Power Electronics Module, and losses in electrical cables and connectors? If so, what efficiency percentages are used for the motor and PEM in the calculations to figure the 2.53km/MJ number? What would that km/MJ number be for a driver who likes to accelerate hard and often?
Note: The following calculations use the average days in a month (365.25days per year / 12 month = 30.4375 days per month).
I don’t wish to discourage, but I want real numbers, not inflated (or deflated) numbers. According to the $0.01 per mile statement on your website, we would figure a maximum of $2.5 every 250 miles (one charge), or an average of $76.09 a month, if you drove 250 miles each day of the month. However, your $0.01 per mile statement takes into account the zero emissions incentives, discounts from off-peak electricity usage when charging, etc. How about you give us a more realistic, day-charge-time, not counting incentives, cost per mile quote? Better yet, here is one based upon my current electricity bill:
I pay $0.09548 per kilowatt hour. That converts to $0.02652 per mega joule ($0.09548 / 3.6 = $0.02652).
Now, 2.53 kilometers per mega joule is equal to 1.57 miles per mega joule (2.53km/MJ = 1.57 mi/MJ)
Also, 1.57 miles per mega joule times 250 miles per charge equals 392.5 mega joules per charge (1.57 mi/MJ * 250 mi/charge = 392.5 MJ/charge)
So every time we charge the car from completely dead batteries, we use 392.5MJ.
392.5 mega joules per charge times $0.02652 per mega joule equals $10.4091 per charge (392.5MJ/charge * $0.02652 per MJ = $10.4091 per charge)
That results in $316.83 per month! Of course, that assumes you drove 7604.167 miles in that month!!!
I wish Tesla Motors the best, and will be watching for the family sedan (or maybe there is a mid-sized SUV coming?)
Travis
PLEASE READ THIS:
www.sciencentral.com/articles/view.php3?language=english&type=&article_id=218392803
Super Battery
Ever wish you could charge your cellphone or laptop in a few seconds rather than hours? As this ScienCentral News video explains, researchers at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology are developing a battery that could do just that, and also might never need to be replaced.
The Past is Future
As our portable devices get more high-tech, the batteries that power them can seem to lag behind. But Joel Schindall and his team at M.I.T. plan to make long charge times and expensive replacements a thing of the past–by improving on technology from the past.
They turned to the capacitor, which was invented nearly 300 years ago. Schindall explains, “We made the connection that perhaps we could take an old product, a capacitor, and use a new technology, nanotechnology, to make that old product in a new way.”
Rechargable and disposable batteries use a chemical reaction to produce energy. “That’s an effective way to store a large amount of energy,” he says, “but the problem is that after many charges and discharges … the battery loses capacity to the point where the user has to discard it.”
Schindall Battery Researcher
But capacitors contain energy as an electric field of charged particles created by two metal electrodes. Capacitors charge faster and last longer than normal batteries. The problem is that storage capacity is proportional to the surface area of the battery’s electrodes, so even today’s most powerful capacitors hold 25 times less energy than similarly sized standard chemical batteries.
The researchers solved this by covering the electrodes with millions of tiny filaments called nanotubes. Each nanotube is 30,000 times thinner than a human hair. Similar to how a thick, fuzzy bath towel soaks up more water than a thin, flat bed sheet, the nanotube filaments increase the surface area of the electrodes and allow the capacitor to store more energy. Schindall says this combines the strength of today’s batteries with the longevity and speed of capacitors.
“It could be recharged many, many times perhaps hundreds of thousands of times, and … it could be recharged very quickly, just in a matter of seconds rather than a matter of hours,” he says.
This technology has broad practical possibilities, affecting any device that requires a battery. Schindall says, “Small devices such as hearing aids that could be more quickly recharged where the batteries wouldn’t wear out; up to larger devices such as automobiles where you could regeneratively re-use the energy of motion and therefore improve the energy efficiency and fuel economy.”
Schindall thinks hybrid cars would be a particularly popular application for these batteries, especially because current hybrid batteries are expensive to replace.
Schindall also sees the ecological benefit to these reinvented capacitors. According to the Environmental Protection Agency, more than 3 billion industrial and household batteries were sold in the United States in 1998. When these batteries are disposed, toxic chemicals like cadmium can seep into the ground.
“It’s better for the environment, because it allows the user to not worry about replacing his battery,” he says. “It can be discharged and charged hundreds of thousands of times, essentially lasting longer than the life of the equipment with which it is associated.”
Schindall and his team aren’t the only ones looking back to capacitors as the future of batteries; a research group in England recently announced advances of their own. But Schindall’s groups expects their prototype to be finished in the next few months, and they hope to see them on the market in less than five years.
Schindall’s research was featured in the May 2006 edition of Discover Magazine and presented at the 15th International Seminar on Double Layer Capacitors and Hybrid Energy Storage Devices in Deerfield Beach, Florida on December 2005. His research is funded by the Ford-MIT Consortium.
Response to the poster who said Tesla needs a “security force” to protect themselves.
The risks from the gasoline incumbents wouldnt likely come is such a direct way.
As others have suggested, the risks of taking on the established industry are more likely:
#1: Lobbyist change laws that make it difficult or impossible to legally operate, sell or service such a vehicle. (Things are a little two sided - some will offer incentives, others will offer obstacles)
#2: Lawyers sue over various claims: safety, false advertising, patent infringement, etc.
#3: Insiders receive outside money to pick less attractive technologies for the company (being kinder than saying “bribery for sabotage”)
Tesla appears to be run by seasoned, successful people who know of such things and how to work around them, so I think we are in good hands in this regards. My bigger concern is that it is hard to get the economies of scale in place to build a cost effective product which results in a business plan that makes money. There are some deep pockets here, but I am sure there needs to be a profit somewhere down the line for the product to stay in production.
The principals are already wealthy and don’t need to go public to raise development capital. Meaning they aren’t subject to a (very) hostile TO at this point. And you can’t disappear high profile SV biz execs as easily as most. Will be interesting to see how many zeros GM/Exxon will have to squeeze onto the check to make this go away.
Ferrari Enzo: $500,000
Gulfstream V: $50,000,000
Helping save the only planet we’ve got: priceless
Hope you boys have the [expletive deleted] to tell them “You don’t have enough ink to write enough zeros.”
Love it. Good luck.
Like most posters here, I am eagerly waiting for your expanded product line. I also have faith that as battery and recharging technology improves, you will be able to retrofit your first models, mostly so that the cars can become more than a close-to-home transportation solution.
I have one question (not that I’m expecting an answer but it struck me as, well, funny): The solar panel idea…since the first models will take a few hours to recharge, and (speculating that) your first customers are likely to be people who are away from home during the day, I would expect most of the home recharging to be done at night. So, how much power do you get out of that panel under the moonlight? Just kidding. Maybe we’ll see a lot more telecommuting in the next few years.
I love this idea but the technology is great just too expensive for any average U.S citizen to buy one of these cars. Then you think about what you can get in this cars price range $80k-$100k, most sports cars are in that range and all most all luxery cars are in there too and all normal everyday vehicles are under that price range. Like I said it is a good Idea but you the company will not sell enough cars to make any money most likely you will lose money big time.
Wow, the roadster looks terrific. I live in Maui, Hawaii. How would owning this car in Maui work for service? I’m extremely interested in the Roadster, my wife would like the sedan!!
Regards,
Bruce Miller
I think this is a beautiful car and a great plan. My concern: I have three children. Any hopes that the family car will seat tall children — all of whom probablye will be teens by the time the model is out?
Best of luck.
Regarding “Power Plant Emissions”, this problem arises in the USA. But for a lot of countries (northern european countries or France), this problem is not even under consideration as their power plant mainly use geothermal, hydro, solar or nuclear material.
And if you consider companies such as nanosolar, you’ll see that the future is bright for 0 emission technologies.
I strongly support what you guys are doing, and believe that you can be the Ford MotorCorp. of the new millenium. Your marketing strategy is great (starting out and aiming at Californians) and I look forward to the rest of the nation catching on. All I’m waiting for is the day that Tesla allows the public to invest. I’m just another Joe ready to put my money where my mouth is.
Great news about your new car. When and how can the average person invest in your company? Dose your business plan incllude an IPO, or will your capital requirements be self funded with the resources of the initial investors and profits?
Just curious, (the car looks GREAT, BTW!), what is powering the interior enviornmental systems on the Tesla Roadster and what kind of a range penalty do you suffer if you operate the car’s heater?
Thanks!
Prototype #1 was just shown at a bay area electric vehicle gathering. The Tesla hosts were very gracious and did an excellent job of answering questions of all sorts. Although rides weren’t given, the car was driven there and people got to examine the car about as closely as you could want with out actually driving it. The more people that get to see it in person, and watch it go, the more believers there will be that this is real and not just a dream.
Some of my questions that got answered:
* No current plans for AWD/4WD, and no front wheel regren braking… Although rear wheel regen can still get about 80% of the energy you would hope to capture with a 4 wheel system.
* Safety has been an utmost design consideration and the battery pack is unlikely to pose any special safety issues.
* Li-Ion is the battery of choice due to the economies of scale that has gone into the laptop production business. The laptop modules are already R&D cost depreciated and offered at agressive prices due to competition. Much Tesla R&D has gone into controllers that manage the properties of the Li-Ion cells, so it is a little unlikely that they would switch to another battery technology anytime soon. (Although they are looking at everything of course)
* This car is attracting as much attention from pure sports car enthusiasts (who may not care what powers it) as it does from EV enthusiasts who appreciate the Li-Ion, advanced motor design, range and all that.
It was more or less confirmed that the first 100 cars will be $100k, and then additional hundreds per year will be sold at about $85K.
They hope to follow-on with a 4 door sedan of some sort with an approx $40k target price as soon as they can.
When asked where they would like to be in 10 years the response was something like “having 4 or 5 models and selling 100,000+ cars per year”. Lets hope!
$85k will be a bit steep for many but I would still consider a cheaper sedan. Whenever you decide to do an IPO please send an e-mail to all who have signed up for information.
It might be a good idea to have a removable battery, so that you can keep one at home being charged while you use the other. Most likely a special device would be needed to get the battery in a out of the car, but I guess it would not be a real obstacle to make this idea work.
Therefore, recharge time ? Less than it would take to fill the tank
And maybe service stations could keep charged batteries, so you could drive in for a battery change. Maybe the battery is too expensive to trust someone would not trade in a bad battery for a good one; this could be solved by a apecial seal and or by a computer check which would tell the real condition of the battery is being traded in.
Think about it !!
Saw the article in Wired, and now have just seen the film (Who killed the Electric Car) - makes me determined to buy one of your cars when they are on sale to the rest of the world. And don’t let GM and big oil beat you with their cruel and stupid domination of the current auto game.
Just one thing though: the styling looks almost identical to a Lotus Elise, which is not surprising as they did most of the design work. But i presume, and hope, that you have made it easier to get in and out of? The Elise is for tiny people only !
Lastly: ever feel like emulating your namesake and investigate how Nicola Tesla’s secret AC black box worked? Now that really would be a breakthrough….
To the fellow who wonders how he will servce his Tesla in Hawaii: is that a job relocation offer? ;^/
TEG wrote up a good summary of the EAASV meeting. I have a slightly different set of notes:
The *base* price of the vehicle is planned to be at $85k. Of course, things can happen between now and then. The $100k “special” does come with some optional equipment.
The sports sedan follow-on was said to be “below $70k, maybe below $60k — a sports sedan”. So, still expensive, but an obvious decrease in price and increase in utility (if not speediness). They are hoping to reach the same range as the sports car in the sedan. That would seem to be quite an achievement to me. Many people that hope for $30k or $20k cars are going to have a wait, or will need to look elsewhere.
They’re response to the low cost car interest seems to be one of marketability concern . If the market broadens to allow for such low cost cars (these necessitate 100 thousand car-sales volume, not to mention much more expensive, and therefore riskier, investments), then the auto-majors are likely to be there. It isn’t clear how they would be successful under such a scenario.
[I guess my thinking is that the personal computer didn’t sell nearly as cheaply, nor nearly in the volume, of the typewriter, but that didn’t stop it from being successful.]
The subject of calendar life of the batteries was broached. It was artfully dodged ;^/ However, it appears that Tesla has some propietary methods on liquid-cooled battery technology. Patents were mentioned. I might try and dig around for them, but I haven’t yet. For those who wonder why there’s a connection, battery longevity is a function of average temperature, average voltage, and time. I don’t know if Tesla is using the full voltage range on their batteries. I expect they are, given some of their answers — pointing out that “dead” in the industry means “80% of original capacity”, and that losing only 20% of range when range is 250 miles is a lot more forgivable than losing 20% of a 40 mile range. Also, to the question “can I upgrade the batteries when my old ones wear out?” their response seemed to be “uhm, we haven’t really given that a lot of thought — our current battery focus is on next vehicle…” They seemed more concerned about impedance aging. I am not sure which environmental factors play a greater role in that specific type of aging.
Their CTO is talking to every battery company he can get his hands on. I believe he said he was off to the East Coast tomorrow…. These guys are pretty serious, and if their battery replacement forecast is correct, they’re getting a pretty good deal. [And frankly, if batteries keep on their 8% per year trajectory, we’re going to start looking really quite good as time wears on.]
Safety seemed to be a primary concern here. They don’t want a brand new brand sullied by a bad experience. I won’t spend a lot of time on this one, but, for all the things talked about here, safety seemed far more important to them. Their pack will survive a catastrophic failure to a cell, for example.
Tooling for the body is done — the car being driven around is apparently off of the honest-to-god line. Having seen it, I’ll say a couple of things. As not everyone has had the chance to drive an Elise, if you’ve seen a Miata, you have a pretty good idea for the size, if not the shape. The thing is *low* to the ground. I would be concerned driving it in some of the parking lots (speed bumps), and the suspension must be pretty stiff. The only bit that didn’t look solid was the hood (the hinge looked very delicate — it’s not holding up a 200 pound piece of metal, of course, but it looked a little light anyway). The trunk apparently had to be closed carefully. I didn’t hear the story behind that.
Everything else was halibut cool. As the crowd was large, I walked away from it while they drove the car around the parking lot. Forget the silly ICE engine noise replacement, this thing needs Lucas ILM sound effect treatment
The car does have a speed-dependent whine which is somewhat reminiscent of the higher frequencies of Star Wars vehicles. Add the dull throb sound effect, and you’re good to go.
They’re aiming pretty low saleswise in 2007. Their 2009 numbers are *very* aggressive, however. I hope they make that many sales.
Hope that helps some
-Dave
Interesting concept. The price is a big problem in the beginning. For the equivalent of 90K You could buy a used Corvette for 35K, 55K would buy ALOT of gas even if it went to $5 per gallon. It really doesn’t seem too practical. If you are rich enough to buy a 90K toy you probably aren’t too worried about the price of gas either. The cost has to come down, WAY down to around the same price as an economy car, to be practical for those that need to worry about gas prices.
(responding to “Guy Marriage”):
Yes, they made a point of making it easier to get in and out of (compared to an Elise).
They also made it more safe in all likelyhood.
Further, by many accounts (including my own) they made it look better.
They are a bit defensive about it not being _JUST_ an electric Elise. There is a lot of Lotus DNA in there, but this vehicle has a lot more engineering applied to it than Lotus would likely have been able to do on their own.
If Tesla had started with a clean sheet of paper, not including Lotus along the way, I think they would have come up with something similar anyways. Having the Elise technology as a basis just shaved a few years, and millions of $ off the project.
sounds like a great car please send specs-pictures i might want to buy one
Travis wrote:
“That results in $316.83 per month! Of course, that assumes you drove 7604.167 miles in that month!!!
The average suburbia would be probably around 2000 miles per month, so that puts us down at $83.33 per month, or 1 1/2 tanks of gas for a pickup truck or SUV at today’s prices.
Beware of centralized power (plug-ins) and keep pushing toward individualized power sources. Pull the grid and make something useful out of all that copper.
Many people have commented on the Wired article about your car. There was a previous edition that had an article on the M1 Lithium Ion Battery. www.wired.com/wired/archive/14.03/start.html?pg=9
Is there any possibility that this particular technology will make it into the first production models? The article speaks of super low recharge times and increased capacity (translates to range). Why the restricitons on initial purchase to California residents? Is it service issues? There are people outside of the state that would love to own one of these, and possibly sell/service them as well.
Two candidates once ran for governor– one of them asked for large campaign contributions from wealthy party supporters, while the other passed a jar around to everybody else and asked each of them for two cents. The man with the jar won because he gained a wider support base of people who were invested in his success. This blog is a great idea– we can all put in our two cents worth, but it would also be great if we could invest money in your company too, however small. We all think your product is great.
After giving the electric vehicle idea more thought, especially in reference to recharging of the batteries, I have an idea for a solution:
Summary:
1. Stock a supply of batteries at selected recharging stations.
2. Customers would exchange their drained batteries for recharged batteries at recharging stations.
3. The design of the electric vehicle should allow quick exchange of batteries.
4. Customers would use the full service lane(s) for battery exchange.
5. Trained attends would swap the batteries for customers.
6. Batteries would belong to the recharging stations.
7. Customers would pay the recharging station a reasonable “use” fee.
8. Recharging station trained attends would maintain the serviceability of the batteries.
9. Recharging stations would also be responsible for proper battery disposal.
More detail for those interested:
1. Stock a supply of batteries at selected recharging (gas) stations.
Select a small number of recharging stations to start out, or perhaps offer a franchise option for those wanting to get involved in the business side of the house, which would accelerate the deployment of recharging stations).
2. Customers would exchange their drained batteries for a recharged set of batteries at these recharging stations. (The recharging stations could be located via GPS).
3. The design of the electric vehicle should allow quick exchange of batteries similar to a gasoline fill up – 10 minutes. (Battery packs could be made of smaller units, I.E. 10 smaller packs to make up the complete pack for easy handling).
4. Initially, customers would use the full service lane(s) for battery exchange.
5. Trained attends would swap the batteries for customers (estimated time of 10 minutes).
6. Batteries would not belong to the vehicle owner but rather recharging stations.
7. Customers would pay the recharging station a reasonable “battery use” and “rental fee” similar to the use of propane tanks.
8. Batteries would belong to the recharging stations and the trained attends would maintain the serviceability of the batteries.
9. Remove the option of owner home charging, as this would take business away from the heavily invested battery recharging vendors. Folks have already been trained to visit a gas station when their fuel indicator nears “E”, why change this habit.
10. Franchises would also be responsible for proper battery disposal, as battery disposal WILL become a large problem in the years to come if battery exchange and disposal is trusted to the end-user.
First, I am glad that someone from Tesla responded to the multitude of posts, and I hope it becomes a regular happening here. Thanks for sheading some light on the “master plan”. I am glad that considerations are made for the masses in delivering something that is beneficial to the environment and serves a usefull purpose. Perhaps, we can get a monthly post detailing the accomplishments of the company and the direction as well. It will give us something to look forward to.
Socondly, I have to believe that there is some resistance to having all-electric cars on the market. If there wasnt, we would have these vehicles right now at an affordable price, since the technology to make this happen has existed for at least 5 or more years. I dont know the politics of it, but I do know that the resistance exists. I hope that Tesla doesnt fall prey to the resistance.
Lastly, there needs to be a better marketing plan to, at least, get the word out. Word of mouth is good but that will only get you so far. Getting the news in a major magazine and keeping Tesla in the news till at least the 4-5 seater version comes out will be beneficial to all. Here’s to making Tesla the new “Model T”. I wish Tesla all the luck, and I will support it by buying a 4-5 seater version. Keep up the good work.
I completely understand your strategy for introducing the sports car first. It does many things for the company, perhaps most importantly, giving the brand credibility.
But I have great concerns, which you seem to be interested in addressing.
First, is the impact on an aging electric grid. If only a fraction of the US population suddenly switched to electric cars, it would crush the electric grid. Yes, it could be upgraded in time, but why?
Your plan for selling solar panels is brilliant, but it should not be optional. It should be built into the cost of the car, and if the customer doesn’t want to take the panels, then don’t give them a discount, but rather add an equivalent amount of solar or wind power into your operations, to reduce the impact that car will now place on the grid and the environment.
My other concern is that you will introduce a wondeful, practical electric car that I will hate (& not buy), because it will have a big, useless trunk. PLEASE offer a hatchback! Even a small SUV would be preferable. Back when Toyota introduced the first Prius, I sent them a nasty letter, because I was in the market for a new car, and the Prius had a small, useless trunk. I also told them I couldn’t even consider the Echo, because they offered a hatch version to everyone in the world but US. Apparently they read my letter at some board meetings, because - combined with the Scion line - they now offer more efficient hatchbacks than anyone. Come on, folks, give me a reason to buy American again.
Many auto parts stores now offer free battery recharging, so it is not inconcevable that in the future, they could offer EV recharging for a fee.
It all looks great, and except for the 250 mile limit… why is that a limit? Because I love to drive, and this car would be a blast! So, I would jump in and drive until the battery was completely dead!
So… how about an optional battery pack that fits in the trunk for those long Sunday drives? Maybe get another 250 miles from it?
So, I can drive into the countryside for lunch, park, plug in, and an hour or two later still have plenty of reserve and recharged power to go, go, go!
Also, with the extra battery pack, if you could get around 500 miles range, then one overnight stop and you could go about 1000 miles. So, you could extend the radius of service access to get much greater consumer covereage with the current technology and as things improve, even greater range, of course. I can hardly wait!
Sounds like a Drive-In restaurant could make for a great way to recharge and keep me driving too!
All the best,
-Scott
Would wildly popular, mass produced and marketed electric cars, as well as other green solutions to our environmental woes make a difference? Yes. Will the combined effect of these alternatives end war in the Middle East or other regions where the struggle for control of resources results in the annihalation of peace, people and culture? No. Despite the technological advances we have wrought, we are still a savage and simple species, and will always find an ideologic excuse for war. We can hope though to go on killing one another in a cleaner environment.
I’m one of the silent ones who privately yearns for an EV as my primary car. Your plans for production instill great amounts of hope in me. I sincerely hope for upcoming, major successes for Tesla Motors.
It seems like a great car. Hopefully after a couple of years it will be at a low enough price for family’s with not a lot of money to buy the car. I have one idea that your builders have probably thought of, but since the engine is in the back you could put some turbines in the back of the grill in front of the car so when your on the highway going 60-70mph the turbines catch the air and there for charge the car up.
Hey, I would really love to work for your company and promote or sell your car. I live in the Chicago area and we have so many people who will buy this car without a second thought. This is a wonderful car and a once in a life time opportunity for someone to get in a starting stages. Please send me a job application and I will wait a year or whenever you are ready to hire in Chicago…The funny thing is that I work for [name deleted]..I welcome any opportunities in the future you may have here in Chicago…
Thanks,
[contact details deleted]
My engine is the most powerful Rotary Piston Engine. At 1/4 the size of today engine, The 16in, rotary putting out over 1600 foot pounds of torque at 800 rpms.
At 3600 rpms over 3200 fot pounds of torque…This is not a joke.
I have a patent on this and want the engine to go into a car..
Its able to get 300 + mile to the gallon, car weight could be under 6000lb.
The 3-piston rotary engine fires every 120 degrees, having a 350 degree power stoke.
the size of the piston is only 1×4inch with a 8in crank, fires at TDC and causing the piston to go in circle is what gives the power torque. This engine is over 85% eff.
Thanks for your web page….Tommey L. Reed Us patent # 6,860,251
Do you no who Edwin Gray was?…
He invented the electric discharge motor, It was able to recharge it self. Using only four batteries. I tested this system and found it works. I build my electric car using for 12v batteries and still testing on it..There is free energy out there, the government don’t want you to know about.
I have been working on a new electric dc motor that has a rotor and a stator design, this motor use less amps then any dc motors out there.
every hp waste 746 watts of power my design waste only 1/3 of that….
The secret is use the magnet flux by pushing the rotor then of spinning in a circle…
like a rail gun. Elctric charge capacitor stores the energy discharge into the stator.
Please make a two wheeled version of your design. Keep it about 325 lbs, same 250 mile range.
Two speed trans with belt drive, abs brakes, around $8k and you’ve got a winner. My current rides’ got pedals but I think I can adapt to electric. Another clever design would incorporate the motor within the wheel hub and save the space in the belly for the batteries…please go public and hire me !!
Love the roadster. However, with a family of four it is not practicable for me. But sign me up for the family sedan along with the optional solar equipment - the sooner the better. Can you tell us how far along you are on the sedan - idea, design, testing? Good luck and keep up the great work.
For long trips, the obvious long term solution to me is to have “stations” like gas stations where you swap out your batteries. You drive up, slide out drained batteries and exchange for a fully charged replacement, for a fee. The battery packs would be standardized such that you would be getting a consistent quality pack (not trading in a good one for a bad one).
Regarding the comment on the Elise. It is hard to get in and out of. However, I’m 6′3″ and 225 pounds. Hardly tiny. But I fit fine.
Clearly guy is much larger than me or he has never been in an Elise.
Why has this taken so long? Why haven’t major corporations and government reached this technology stage to date?
Welcome Elon Musk to a world where little people care and can make a difference. The future and the state of the environment looks promissing all of a sudden.
Great work, and let me know when I can have one of these Roadsters.
Cam Tofano
Ontario, Canada
Dear Mr. Musk
I can hardly put into words how excited I am after thoroughly (read: greedily) devouring the information on both your website and blog. Surely many from my generation remember being promised electric and even flying cars when we were growing up in the late eighties. Well, sadly you car does not fly…instead it jets in a way I never thought a pure electric car could! Amazing, amazing, amazing! Your car and company is the best news I have heard since before a nefarious shrub sadly took office. Our roads are clogged with gas guzzling SUVs, clogged with overheating cars, overheating tempers all because the price of oil has run too high. We, America’s soldiers, America’s youth are done paying the price for our country’s dependence on oil. Thank you for granting us the independence we have been waiting for, a choice that calls with the voice of dissent, a choice that will carry us into a cleaner and brighter future. Thank you.
It is sad to see that in order to create a car to save us from global warming we have to first create a car that appeals to the 17 year old mentality. “Burn Rubber not gas”. There are others out there tZero from AC Propulsion (zero to 60 in 4,1 secs) and the Tango by Commuter Cars. (George Cloony bought one of the first), zero to 60 around 4 secs.
But let’s consider another alternative not discussed in any of the blogs on this site so far.That alternative is the flex-fuel-plug-in hybrid .
Take a Prius, for example. Add enough extra battery storage for a range of 35 miles. Charge these extra batteries at night (hence plug-in). Switch to the electric only mode. Drive the day shopping or commuting up to 35 miles to work. Recharge at work for the ride home. With the Prius you cannot go over 34 mph in the electric mode. (This should be altered so you can go at least 70 mph). If you keep within the 35 mile range. You can drive pure electric for days maybe weeks until you have to get any gas. When you want ot take a trip longer than 35 miles flip the switch to hybrid and hit the road.
Conversions of a Prius done by several individuals have been getting 100 mpg, more in some cases.
But wait. There’s more. Make that hybrid a flex-fuel vehicle (able to run on gas OR ethanol or any combination thereof). Now you have a car that doesn’t need any gasoline but could use it if nothing else is available
Or make that a Diesel plug-in hybrid running on Biodiesel. No gasoline needed but could run on regular diesel if necessary.
You say your commute is more than 35 miles. Fine, For a little more money add a more efficient battery pack. Extend the range to 100 miles in electric mode.
Most of your driving, unless driving is your business, Will be electric only. How often do you go over 100 miles a day?
When you want to go on a trip switch to hybrid mode. My Prius will take me 600 miles on a tank of gas . Add 100 in the electric mode you get 700 miles
Since you get less miles per gallon with ethanol, your maximum range would drop down to around 550 to 600 miles total, with no gas.
Now here’s the icing on the cake. You can use the battery in your hybrid as a backup power supply for your household during electric blackouts. Your car can be the generator for the battery which is back up for the house.
Toyota is now producing flex-fuel vehicles for the Brazilian market. They are finally saying they will consider the plug-in concept. A flex-fuel Plug-in hybrid can be produced and sold for under $40,000 if mass produced. We are talking about a real solution here. It can be done. We need the will to do it.
I would like to open a Tesla Motors car dealership and repair shop in Milan Italy, how much do you want to let me do that?
Ciao Paolo
Governments dont want any one to come out with alternative energy like , Electric cars.
In fact the US taxes on gas makes the government lot os money, about 1/2 of a gallon of gas is taxed.
The more miles to the gallon of gas you get, The less money the government gets on taxes! They don’t want to cut their pay check….Its about Them self not the puplic!
On the electric car, how long do the batteries last, and how much to replace them.
As you all should know thr more you charge them, the less life spam they have.
I have a converted toyota care that use four 12v batteries that’s only about 24wk of energy. It weight is 4000lb. goes about 50mph. only travels about 5 miles right now.
I like to test with less, Because i learn alot on redesigning the electric motor.
The battery solution is here and am surprised no one’s mentioned this. JPL and a private firm called Altair, together invented a new lithium polymer battery that is not the garden variety lithium ion, rather called “polymer lithium-ion” (PLI) nanotech battery. It is a dry battery and won’t explode therefore if it accidently shorts out such as in an auto wreck or malfunction due to vibration or jarring, you aren’t propelled vertically out of the wreck by a battery turned bomb. Present lithium ion batteries and NiHH do have liquid inside and therefore will explode (and have..cell phone incidents are the more common) if the electrodes on the battery touch and short out. Shorted out liquid batteries can spray extremely hot corrosive fluids and aeorsols onto victims just as exploding gasoline tanks or gas tank contents have incinerated victims/bystanders/rescue workers of car wrecks. This new battery doesn’t have those threats.
Anyway, the new PLI charges in five to ten minutes for a car sized battery which is about the same amount of time it takes to fuel up at a gas station and holds ten times the charge as a standard Li or Ni ion battery per weight and size, and deliver peak amps when you need them such as hill climbing or fast acceleration. In addition they take over a hundred thousand charges as opposed to a much less capacity of standard LiMH or NiHM batteries. Learn more here:
www.altairnano.com/
from that private sector inventor company which worked with JPL… and the licensee in China who now produces the batteries for sale:
www.zqpt.com/zqenglish/page3.htm
…and that company says it will custom make batteries for whatever application…and I would bet to include Tesla Motors cars.
Hello,
two questions, maybe not the first time asked:
1. how safe is the battery in a case of a crash, there are much electrical energy and chemicals?
2. what is the expected app. price for a new battery after 100.000 miles?
Thanks!
I want to sell them. I am in the New York City area.
You are such a brave pioneer and I applaud your incredible vision and ability to pursue it….you may just change the world after all
I will of course (as a poorly paid writer) have to wait until you create the cheep & cheerful version - but wait I will. Well done to you and your team and thank you from my future grandchildren. Namaste, Tina Louise
I am very intrigued with the product. Any investment information would be appreciated.
I’ll be first in line for the family car - If I were still single and without a kid on the way, I would be on your signature 100 list - After all, I am in Hollywood and I want everyone to want what I have! (tee hee)
What is this car going to cost? I know it won’t come cheap…but the savings on gas alone will probably make up for it
Okay, I just have one question .. plus some friends along for the ride.
Exactly, what type of fluids will be in this vehicle?
How many movaeable parts will this car have as compared to regular cars?
How much cooler (temperature wise) is this car as compared to a regular car?
How about an optional battery pack for future models so you could get extra range?
Portable or at home solar recharging?
Since I am already producing a surplus of Solar Photo Voltaic power I want a EV as soon as poossible. I have been seriously considering the Toyota synergy drive vehicles with the CalCars type of conversion so that I can take advantage of my surplus. I like the Tesla Roadster except the high cost is way beyond my retirement budget. A mini van style is more appropriate to my current needs but a 4 doorr sedan is what I have (Chrysler 300M).
The 30 K price range is what I would like to see for an EV for me, might swing 40 K considering that the mechanical components should have at least a 25 year life expectancy based on other traction motors (locomotives and streetcars). The Li-ion batteries are much better than deep cycle lead acid if charged and discharged correctly as I am sure the Tesla charging controller is designed to do.
The advent of computer controls for the motor/generator controls and charging circuits are the major improvement in EV technology that makes EVs more practical today.
I hope that they can mass produce this and eventually make a 4×4, off the beaten path with adequate ground clearance vehicle with which I can drive 36,000 miles a year like I now do! It will be awhile before that happens.
Congratulations on the Tesla Roadster. If it is a commercial success, Great!
Is Tesla the name behind the disappointing Free Electricity project from the late Nineties, that caused so much bitter argument regarding Permanent Magnet Motors? I have been trying to follow that subject for a number of years, but they will no longer talk to me, Was that a Scam?
To follow-up on the removable battery idea… Tesla Motors should enter into a strategic partnership with Batteries Plus, whch already has nearly 300 retail outlets in America, and does just that, take care of all of one’s battery needs, from laptop to automotive. If the battery inside the Tesla roadster was designed in such a way as it would be easily switched, just like any appliance, service stores like Batteries Plus, could easily become the automotive fueling stations of the future. This future could be now, in a matter of a few months, if MIT’s licensing dept. allowedDr. Sadoway’s Slimcell into production.
The Tesla engineer who drove the car to the EAASV meeting was 6′4″ He fits in the car. It is a low sports car and is harder to get in and out of than a typical car, but even tall drivers can fit and enjoy driving it.
===
The idea of having swappable battery packs has some merit, but some complications.
On the one hand no one would be having fears of how long the batteries will last if there is a depot constantly replacing the aged ones with fresh ones. On the other hand, the infrastructure to keep fully charged packs at the ready in convenient locations would be much more trying than simply having electrical outlets for charging.
Further complicating this idea is that the battery packs are not simply easy to change like flashlight batteries. The pack is one big unit that is very heavy, and has a lot of connections not the least of which are coolant lines. The battery pack is much more wired into the car than a simple 12v battery with only two wires. Also, keep in mind that the battery pack is a safety hazzard. The high voltage DC (if exposed) could be lethal and a fire hazzard. There would need to be some complicated quick disconnect system (for both high voltage DC, coolant and control lines) that would add weight, cost and complexity. Maybe someday, but I don’t think they want that for the first model.
I think GM talked about swappable packs for the EV1 but never did it.
Some places where you get BBQ propane cylinders switched to a swap system.
Propane cylinders are safety rated and safety tested for a limited number of years.
After a few years no one will refill your old cylinder anymore. These days swapping for a fresh, filled one is good because you don’t have to worry about yours getting too old.
In some ways, things that you know will be obsolete or out of date quickly do make sense to lease.
I could see that someday you would buy the car and lease the battery pack, so that you could expect to get an updated version as soon as available without having to buy it outright. In a way it is insurance against having out of date battery technology.
I noticed that cable and satellite TV have switched more and more to a lease/rent system for their boxes. They know that their receiver technology keeps changing rapidly so having leased items that they can “force” the customer to upgrade is preferable to have a lot of customers with outdated equipment that may not work as the company would like.
i’m in a hybrid now. can’t afford your signature model, but would sure like to try and get into an electric car soon. congratulations and i look forward to the updates.
Can’t wait to see it. Will it be equipped with high mileage tires also, to reduce that waste?
I love your roadster and admire the vision and the business plan. What you need to jump start this EV Revolution is a lot of publicity and celebrity endorsements (preferrably for free of course).
Have you thought about contacting Jay Leno at Tonight’s Show? Not only he is a bonafied “car nut,” I’m sure he would love to be the first to test drive this one of a kind car. Just imagine the possibilities if he loves it, which I’m sure he will!
Good luck TeslaMotors!
What a great car! Now if you’re really interested in the planet first, you’ll let the many thousands of your instant fans invest, along with the billions in smart green money, in an immediate IPO to raise the Billion $ needed to rush the thrid gen vehicle for the millions right away.
And borrow more, sell more stock at every opportunity to build it faster. We really don’t have the luxury of waiting even 5 years for the ultimate family car, the climate is too close to the tipping point to delay another moment.
I sure don’t have $90K for a car, but I’d invest plenty in this. If you’re worried about losing control, just sell non-voting shares (like Ford), we’ll still invest.
What about Edwin Gray electric discharge motor?…
In the 70s he invented this motor that had self recharging system with only four batteries?
This was Tesla idea, The state of calf. close his company down because it worked.
What makes any other idea any different?
Are you7 using supercapacitors to deliver power fast? or just hte Li ion batteries?
RMM
I have a feeling we are looking at a whole new era of transportation. I am curious to see how Tesla motors will succeed where companies like AC Propulsion and Universal Electric haven’t gotten their fast 2 seater EVs out of concept and into production.
I love the concept, but I am a fan of large coupes, the likes of Honda Accord Coupe or Mercedes-Benz CL, as roadsters while fun are impractical, and family sedans are boring as hell. I would definately buy one from you, if you were to make one around $30K, and with range from LA to Las Vegas. That would be great!
www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article872161.ece
Ford will return 300 electric cars
About 300 used Think cars will be returned to Norway from the American and European markets. Ford’s plans to destroy the fully operable vehicles, which are in great demand in Norway, led to widespread protests and demonstrations by environmental and motoring organizations.
Related stories:
Ford may spare Think cars - 27.08.2004
Ford blasted for crushing ‘Think’ cars - 24.08.2004
Car maker pins hopes on boxy ‘minibus’
Car maker pins hopes on boxy ‘minibus’ - 21.06.2004
‘Think Public’ targets new user niche - 21.06.2004
‘Think’ boss denies shut-down - 03.06.2004
Game may be over for el-car venture - 01.06.2004
The vehicles will be assessed by Ford’s technical experts to determine how many are roadworthy.
Transport Minister Torild Skogsholm was informed of the decision by the vice-president of Ford Motor Company Europa, Ingvar Sviggum, on Thursday morning.
The cars will be transported for free from the USA to Norway by shipping company Wallenius Wilhelmsen.
Joe Kearney: I think they plan to “stick” with performance tires. This car is more about performance than ultimate range.
Wen H Lin: I think these guys are masters at generating publicity.
Tommey L. Reed: These guys want proven technology, not something that was rumored to work in a lab.
Robert Metzger: No ultracapacitors (yet). They are Li-Ion for now.
Travis: Tesla has more chance for success because they have lots of venture money to make the dream real, unlike those other companies you mentioned.
Michael Clark: check this out: www.youtube.com/watch?v=sS3WbXb1baY
Lets be up front, Electric cars use too much power to run down the road.
At 200 kw of energy thats enough to run 10+ houses with the ac running.
What about shorts in the batteries? Electrical fires are very bad…There needs to be a new electric motor design: My design is to have a spinning stator and rotor, with capacitor discharge coils. Like a rail gun.: AdvanceEnergySystems.com
I have the now how to make a eletric motors that performs better then any out there.
Magnet flux is weak around its field, heat makes it weaker.
Very exciting concept — if this is version 1 can’t wait for 2 and 3. I wonder about distribution though — seems like auto dealers will lose out on all that service revenue from replacing oil filters and engine maintenance. Looks like a great car — I want one!
TEG…did you check the PLI battery source yet I posted? 10x the charge for same weight as LiMH…you could reduce weight AND increase range at the same time…please check this out.
This would power the 4 seater family car folks want with ease. BTW the crude remark made by poster above refering to mentality of a 17 year old sucks. I am 60 and I love to burn rubber so go fly a kite.
Finally, a car worthy of plugging my iPod into!
I’d like a blue sedan, and throw in a set of solar panels for the garage.
While I’m waiting for delivery, where can I purchase a Tesla Motors t-shirt?
Valdez: I have given up asking Tesla about their battery choices, or suggesting alternatives to them.
You can’t expect them to be able to re-engineer to the absolute latest technology on short notice. They picked something that was more or less state of the art at the time, and they are going with it for now.
At the top of their list of priorities is safety, and many of these newer battery technologies are questionable in that area as packaged.
Some links for reference:
jcwinnie.biz/wordpress/?p=963
www.batterypack.com.tw/lp.htm
For every thousand people that commits one thousand dollars to help R and D you would have an extra million with which to work. You could offer people the option to put a one thousand dollar down payment on a potential future car. Each person that buys one could simply claim a one thousand dollar credit toward the purchase. If you could get a million people internationally to put a thousand dollars down, you would have a billion dollars with which to work. You could also make a deal where you commit to honor one million contracts when one million people have signed up. Even if only ten percent follow through you will have one hundred million with which to work. This is the critical mass approach that is being used by the so-called hundred dollar computer project.
I just want to be sure that this company is not being prepared to be sold to the highest bidder. Some large company, or group of large companies, can surpress this technology. I am willing to put my money where my mouth is to make certain that this technology is not suppressed. Like the original Macintosh computer, I want the mission of your company to bring power to the people.
I have seen the hydrogen fuel news post. I know a way to take salt water and to convert it into hydrogen fuel .
I did a experiment with 36v dc and kept a flame going using only 10 amps.
and it did not eat up the probes….AdvanceEnergySystems.com
As mentioned above, there are plenty of people out there who would love to invest in the green technology that Tesla is developing, but simply cannot afford the $89k Roadster. How about you come up with a “Future Lease” plan!? I’d love to start paying you car payments for my $30k sedan that will be ready in 3-5 years. Heck, I could have the car paid off before I drive it, and you’d have the money pouring in, ready to use for development!
So if you take the idea, you’ve got my email address. You’ll know where to send the royalties… or my Roadster!
Gentleman,
Are you a public company. If so where can I get share information?
B. Authors.
—-
Editor’s answer: No, Tesla Motors is a privately held company. More info is here.
Tesla Motors,
You guys nailed it! The days of the garage-built, nerd-mobile, electric car are over. The result of your innovation and determination is what everyone else will be compared to. It will be interesting to see what kind of response comes out of Detroit.
Lawrence A. Kalina
IDSA
My thought about super-battery technology. . . From where I sit, Tesla Motors seem to be going for proven batteries that are available off-the-shelf from multiple manufacturers, so competition can hold the price down. I’m sure they are watching all developments and are interested in what’s in the labs — but there is also a cost for going too far out on the cutting edge. That’s part of what separates the $89,000 Tesla Roadster from the $660,000 Venturi Fetish.
Now for some entertainment: www.the-dispatch.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060807/COLUMNS/608070335/1041/news
The 1966 news report from Ford is both sad and funny, and raises real questions. The most obvious question would be: What happened?
hi, what a fantastic car! I really really want one!
Please please please release a right hand drive version into the UK! (we ARE building it you know, oh and our tiny island isn’t much bigger than 250 miles either!)
Is it worth talking to Lotus to see if they have any plans?
keep up the great work.
jk
Choices—we could have spend the 200 Billion on WAR on Tesla roadsters and purchased over 2 Million cars for Americans.
OR at least given Americans the tax credits of 50K+ that Hummer mommies got and over 4 million roadsters would have been sold and produced with the associated advances in technology.
Choices!
I’ve heard that electric cars generate electromagnetic radiation. I’ve even heard they expose their passengers to something like 30x more electromagnetic radiation than living under power lines does.
Is this true?
If so, has Tesla found or is Tesla currently developing a solution to this problem?
If so, how have they done or how are they doing so?
Thank you,
I’m extremely excited about this company
—-
Editor’s Answer: Check out the FAQ.
Is there any danger from electromagnetic fields in the Tesla Roadster?
It’s interesting to note that low-frequency electromagnetic radiation from power lines was a big scare about 15 years ago, but numerous, rigorous studies have shown that there is no correlation between power line EMF and ailments attributed to them.
Please succeed. Please. You’ve obviously got the marketing down, and your timing is perfect. But please, get the manufacturing right. Show the rest of the brain-dead auto industry that electric cars can be mass produced and mass marketed with equally impressive efficiency. Please. Please. Please. No joke, the future of the planet is riding on this.
When do these come down to Australia?
Have you considered retrofit technology packaging to outfit older petrol powered cars? Is there a market for that - I daresay there would be in the future with fuel to hit AU$1.80 per litre for standard unleaded down here.
Sure this car is expensive; but if this takes off like it should, construction costs will come down - that’s the whole point. I’m sure, relatively speaking, combustion cars were considerably expensive when they debuted.
As I mentioned on Autoblog for those muttering about the electric grid - it would be better to build a handful more plants and have the fuel-to-energy inefficiences concentrated amongst those plants, than have the sum total of the inefficiency of millions upon millions of cars. I think it’s less than 30% of fuel energy in modern cars goes into the motion of the car, the rest is noise, heat, and sound. It would make more sense to build 50 more COAL plants than have millions upon millions of wasteful cars, trucks, busses and planes. Plus you can utilize additions to the grid, like solar arrays and hydro sources, to keep the use of fuel for powerplants down.
At last a car manufacturer making sense. I cant beleive it. This is the best thing i have seen for years, and I am behind this technology 100%.
I will be buying one in the future, as soon as I can aford it.
Tesla should take James advice (scroll up) and let individuals purchase a “Thousand Dollar Pre-Payment Agreement”. Take the money and create the best possible electric sedan and all wheel drive vehicles. Investors could decide to purchase and then be eligible for a one thousand dollar “credit”. If they didn’t like the cars, the money would convert to stock or the individual could decide to “gift” the money to Tesla. This is a win, win, win, win opportunity (except for big oil and GM).
Please work towards getting these cars into Europe very very soon (and particularly the UK, as this is where I live). I want my next car to be as environmentally conscious and useful (in terms of distance especially) as the cars you have produced. I’m afraid though that I’ll be waiting for the family car to arrive, much as I love the design of your current model, I need a four to five person vehicle with boot space - please fulfil this wish and I will be waiting with my deposit (oh, and 0% finance would be great too).
I live in miami and am waiting to buy. I think one of the biggest possibilities the company has is to change the automotive industry isn’t just energy effciency of the products but to go to a direct sales internet based model such as Dell. Existing car companies can not do this due to state franchise laws that protect their dealer networks.
I think Tesla could build a just in time inventory system that would allow them to hold zero inventory, In addition , there would be no dealer markup on cars, no dealer inventory to finance. Outsourced manufacting labor would not have to be burden by high legacy costs such as healthcare benefits for retirees. This could give the company thousands of dollars in cost savings versus traditional automobile companies.
This is the real secret to this company competing in the long term.
All the best luck!
Fortune magazine has recently published a list of the world’s largest companies (according to revenue). I found it interesting that 9 out of the top 10 were either oil companies or the auto manufactures that choose to burn oil.
1. Exxon Mobil
2. Wal-Mart Stores
3. Royal Dutch Shell
4. BP
5. General Motors
6. Chevron
7. DaimlerChrysler
8. Toyota Motor
9. Ford Motor
10. ConocoPhillips
I can only imagine the kind of political influence these companies must have in shaping domestic and foreign policies (not to mention their ability to influence public perception as well). There is also those who are vested in these companies (i.e. employees, shareholders, oil producing nations, etc.) I sense it will require a major paradigm shift in the thinking and action of many to wean ourselves off of oil, but given the remarkable works of people like those at Tesla Motors, I feel confident that that shift will take place. Thank you again Tesla for your wonderful achievement, it is a true gift to the entire world.
I usually buy a new car every 5 years, the reason for me is that at 5 years cars start to become a risk. Belts break, cylinders leak, transmissions fail, hoses leak, pumps die and so on. The Tesla roadster looks like a forever car. Even given the current costs I could easily compare a new battery set every 80k-100k miles with gasoline and the cost would be similar for much better performance in the electric.
I’m not talking like a green freak, just someone who loves driving and doesn’t like having a car break down on me. Knowing that this car will reduce my personal auto pollution in my state by something close to 90% doesn’t mean that much to me for this discussion, I’m purely considering the car on a cost/benefit.
Is there any information on how long you see the motor and transmission lasting?
LED lights last forever and take little power so that’s a bonus.
I worry about all the typical car parts that are still in the Tesla. The convertable top, the door latches, the ruggedness of handles and knobs. Did Tesla take short cuts with all of these to meet weight?
I know I’m being greedy, but I’d like a car built to last along with have great performance.
I’ll be selling my Porsche 911 - I’m starting to feel dirty when I start up that big engine now.
I like John R’s idea about the future lease plan, you guys should make that happen!
Note: There are 2 Travis’ posting here… My only other post was the long one on the cost per mile.
After reading some other blogs here, and some responses in this one, it has become obvious that Tesla Motors does not want to be publically traded, at least for the time being. It is also obvious that Telsa Motors has significant monitary resources from private investors.
Despite that, I would still like the ability to donate something to the cause. If it helps bring the family sedan that much faster, it’s well worth it.
Another thing I’m noticing is that there are many questions being asked here that are answered quite well in the website, so I would encourage anyone new here to read everything on the website first. I was one of those greedily devouring all the information I could find - in fact it’s all I talked about for several days
Everyone in my family knows about this car now. If only they would be willing to pool enough money together to purchase one of these cars…
Of course, in my dreams where I have one of these, the first to go would be the stereo - replaced with a touchscreen, CarPC, and aftermarket amps! Sorry, I can’t leave the stereo alone. I gotta have the PC for WIFi, GPS, and a better mp3 management than an iPod offers, not to mention a bigger screen.
Travis
First of all I really admire your motivation and ideals, but I am a bit skeptical how you will make an efficient family type car using this technology. Looking at the car diagram, the batteries take up the space of two seats. How will you be able to have a 4 seat car, have room for luggage and still make it run for around 250 miles? The weight of a family car with 4 people + luggage as opposed to this sports car…..
0-60mph in 4 seconds! Holy Cow! Nicely done.
When you get a family hauler (6 passenger + gear) I will get in line to buy one. If I had extra money I would consider investing in your company. I am very impressed with everything you have accomplished.
I think that if you built an affordable commuter car (comfortable, not cheap) in the future you would see large sales numbers as most folks could commute without worry.
Again, well done.
Hello,
I long for the day when I can afford a great electric vehicle. Years ago I bought an electric van that I loved. I love all things solar and truly believe that if I had an electric car I would be able to support it (at least on the home end) by a bank of solar panels. Has that been a viable method used by anyone?
I will be watching, waiting and hoping that soon I will be able to drive one of your vehicles in the near future. All the best luck.
N
I am a Chartered Electrical Engineer aged 58. I have been dreadfully frustrated for over 30 years by the past ‘false dawns’ relating to usable electric cars. It is clear that technological advances must have been delayed or stopped by the vested interests of the Oil industy. It was therefore with great delight that I spotted and article in the UK Times newspaper today which prompted me to look at this site / blog.
If you do not start planning immediately for a right hand drive european version to be on the market within 18 months, I will be forced to come over to Silicon Valley for a ‘closed-door interview (without coffee)
Fantastic concept - not only does the Tesla appear to be practical, it also looks adorable and the performance speaks for itself - I can’t wait to be able to buy one. Soon PLEASE !!!!
I just wanted to say that I’m very excited about this, and I’ll be first in line to buy one of the more-affordable models! Thank you for being a responsible businessman. This is great.
Sir, do you use off-the-shelf L-ion batteries? If so, have you talked to the folks at www.a123systems.com?
Last week I fell into a blue funk after watching a broadcast on the Discovery Channel called Global Warming - What You Need to Know. Tom Brokow was the host and he presented a very convincing argument that our world is heating up and that if we don’t reduce CO2 emissions, the consequences will be dire. Towards the end of the show several scientists, who were all certain that global warming is a fact, stated that they were optimistic that we (as a country, as global citizens, as humans) would find a solution to this problem. Many of them were convinced that technology and market forces would drive the economy green and that we would be able to reduce green house gas emissions and avoid a world wide enviromental disaster without economic recession or collapse.
It is my hope that your company is rediculously successful and that you continue to on the path to make cars that all of us can afford. It is also my hope that you are able to license your technology to the big auto makers so that we can change Detroit forever. The invisible hand that keeps the economy moving foreward is about to give the oil companies a big push to becomming diversified, greener, renewable energy companies. Those companies that do not diversify will get slapped insted.
Your company and its excellent web site have lifted the cloud of CO2 that was following me around all week. I have two daughters, ages 3 and 5. It is my hope that the first cars (or seeing as we live in TEXAS, should I say TRUCKS) I buy for them are Teslas!
Suggestion for something else to put in the plan, potentially sooner than later: postal delivery vehicles. They have the records to do a very easy ROI on the purchase price of the vehicle and their needs are well documented (number of miles per day, etc). Also, the cost of a “sale” is less because you sell each post-office (or region?) a ‘fleet’ of them. Then sell them the solar panels to charge them at night (since they never run at night) and possible a custom fleet charging station of some kind (even a solar panel on the roof since they aren’t parked in a garage all day like many commuter cars).
just a thought.
main message: Thanks! and Keep Going!
I read the white paper “21st Century Electric Car” again today. In the paragraph ‘Electric Cars’ the energy efficiency for the Tesla is quoted as 2.18km/MJ. However, the paragraph headed “Hydrogen Fuel Cell Cars” you state “and we can assume the same 2.78 km/MJ vehicle efficiency as with the electric car.” 2.18 versus 2.78 ? Please explain.
Thanks
—-
Editor’s Thanks: In the ‘Electric Cars’ paragraph, we are talking about electric outlet-to-wheels efficiency (which includes charger inefficiencies), while in the “Hydrogen Fuel Cells” paragraph, we are talking about energy storage-to-wheels efficiency, which does not include the charger. However, the number in the hydrogen paragraph was indeed wrong, and should have been 2.53 km/MJ, not 2.78 km/MJ. This mistake made the fuel cell solution look better than it should have. The white paper will be updated soon to reflect this correction.
Energy Efficiency
The figures you use for the electric car relate to the most efficient means of electricity production i.e. “combined cycle” natural gas-fired electric generator.
How do the other means of production compare and what is the well-to-wheel efficiency of the electric car using the average efficiency of these ?
i am very impressed with your philosophy, goals and what you have accompilshed so far.
I am looking forward to owning an affordable electric vehicle and even better, one that can
be powered from electricity i can generate from a renewable source. Using the figures you
give for the sportscar I don’t see getting 50 miles from a roof mounted solar panel. (as much as I wish it were possible) 2.53 Km/mj works out to 11kw at, I assume, 100km/hr. A 208 watt solar panel is about the largest that you could fit on the roof, and that would only give you 10-15 km.
A van roof however with 8m2 could approach 10kwhr and 50 miles per day.
Is my math way off or did you have some other system in mind.Did you mean mount a number of panels on the roof of your house? the solarcity site doesn’t help explain.
I am working on a solar powered water purifier for villages in a third world country, and I am finding it very difficult to get any help or information from solar panel or cell manufacturers about concentrator systems and non retail pricing. Is there anyone at solarcity who could help?
Thanks
Round numbers…about how long until we can buy model #2?
Congratulations on hitting 100!
How about something really radical for #2? Something virtually no automobile company has been willing to build in 25 years? A small stationwagon! Call it a crossover or whatever to keep the marketing people happy, but a vehicle somewhere between a 1990 Civic Wagon and a Subaru Forrester. With a kammback (not as radical as the Prius), it would be possible to build a four passenger vehicle with headroom for everyone and still keep the co-efficient of drag under 0.30. The Civic Wagon hit 0.34. Enough ground clearance to survive a few potholes? Enough room behind the second seat for a big dog?
Mind you, I’m not asking for 4-whell drive… yet.
The stated 2.53 km/MJ is derived how? what test conditions was this under? If i take the roadster to the track 100 miles away, do a good hard 40 laps @ streets of willow, will i be able to make the 100 mi trip back to LA? How does the energy mileage change when the character of driving changes? This being a sports car makes this a potentially major point.
Hey Elon
I am under the impression that Li-ion batteries are not recommended for deep-cycling (squeezing close to all of their charge) before the next recharge as that diminishes their amp-hours.
Please comment vis-a-vis the Tesla powerplant.
Nitin
—-
Editor’s Surprise: The answer to your question can be found on the Charging and Batteries page.
My calculations show that a recharge would have to transfer 183 MJ of energy. The British supply system of 220 volts would mean a transfer current of 60.6 Amps over the 3.5 hours charge time. The supply fuse to my house is rated at 60 Amps so I would have to have a special (probably 415 volt?) supply run in especially for the Tesla - pricey. In the US, 115 volt supply would double this problem. How have you planned for this ?
I ‘m italian and I owe a lotus elise … I’ve been looking forward to make its convertion to EV since many years..
is the chassis of your roadster exactly the same??
will you put on the market a conversion kit easy to fit to my elise in the next future??
thanks and all the best
iDEA: iFTHE BATTERIES ARE STILL GOOD AT THE END OFTHEIR PREDICTED TRANSPORTATION LIFE, WHY NOT CONTINUE THE PROCESS AND USE THESE TO GENERATE ELECTRIC FOR THE HOME, STILL RECHARGING BY SOLAR, GAS,ETC. EFFICIENCY IS NOT NEAR AS CRITICAL AS WHEN WEIGHT IS A CONSIDERATION
Cold Fusion was NOT a hoax, not bad science, and is alive and well!
Check www.lenr-canr.org and look at some of the myriad of technical papers and/or lay-person articles.
Research is going on privately by a dedicated international group of about 1000, who care more for humanity and truth than their professional careers. (14th int’l conference coming up)
ANYWAY, the point is this:
Cold fusion has the energy density, low cost, and cleanliness to be THE answer for electrical vehicles, in spades.
When it can climb out of the tremendous PR travesty about it, there had better well be an electric-only vehicle WORTHY of such cheap, abundant, local, and lightweight power.
Added advantage - easy fill-ups. Fresh heavy water (deuterium based, from sea-water) gets pumped in, perhaps some new electrodes (paladium or hopefully soon nickel) get replaced and you’re up and running for perhaps 1000 miles or more.
If you can GENERATE the electricity onboard with ZERO harmful emission, which CF promises, the charging issue is no longer a problem, nor is the battery issue a problem.
ULTIMATE dream car - Tesla four-door with onboard cold fusion generation and perhaps some ultra-capacitors which get self-charged by the vehicle 24 hours a day!
Before you laugh … or flame me… check low-energy nuclear reactions out for yourself, even briefly.
What are the company plans as far as international (outside North America and EU) sales? I live in China and would love to see Tesla, and other electric vehicles enter the asian market.
Best of luck–Mike
I LOVE this car - the concept and the reality are LONG overdue - WELL DONE. However, as a father , I will be waiting for the sedan/SUV affordable option. Humanities lecturers/academics don’t earn big bucks here in the UK!
.
I have wanted to be energy self-sufficient and totally green for about 20 years now. when you have gone past step 3 it sill tiie innicely with my future plans of solar panels on my roof, plus the wind turbines and borehole in the garden!
All the best and good luck to you and the whole company.
Seradr and family
sorry for the misspellings - buying new keyboard today.
Wow! I am so impressed. I hope and pray that your long range plans will work for us all. Just don’t sell out and don’t let the power mongers kill you! Nicola Telsa would be proud. It is too bad our world was not ready for all of his inventions. Too much greed. We would all have free non-poluting energy if it were up to him.
Response to Mihai comment above: I’ll tell you how to make the 4-seat car- raise it higher off the ground, like a small suv ,and put all the batteries below the seats: as wide as the car and as long as the wheelbase. Would make for good handling with low center of gravity.
The batteries are still too less energy for the size of them…New to redesign the electric motor to get the most out it.
I gotta admit, my desire for a ‘high performance’ car, or eco Prius, evaporated when I read the engineering details of the Testla and saw the torque curve!
Six litre engines and 7 speed gearboxes are just mechanical workarounds to get a lot of power out of an in-efficient gas/petrol system.
Like the previous commentator, I was worried about the Li-Ion batteries and their tendency for thermal runaway if damaged, but if you set one on fire and the car coped with it, then that’s good. This system has to be safer than a large tank of volatile fuel, and I am aware of people who survived car accidents but were trapped and died when the fuel tank went on fire.
Keep up the great work, and best of luck with the new model(s).
I think what you are doing is fantastic i love the care, i mean i really love the car, i hope you will concider the uk market, i hope one day i will be able to afford the tesla roadster, this is the kind of stuff we need to save the earth, this is what we need to stop our dependancy on oil and give all our children a future, dont give up i hope one day you are bigger than all the motor companies i hope you become as wealthy as bill gates for if you pull this off and go mass market with it, you will be, you are the pioneers of today the knights of tommorow the saviours of our planet, my god bless you and help you along this road to bring about a greener planet, thank you.
dave jackson
I think the line from the movie “Field of Dreams” applies to Telsa Motors…
If you Build it , They will Come.
electriccarinsider.blogspot.com
I am really, really hoping you guys are incredibly successful! It makes me proud as a resident of the Bay Area that Silicon Valley is leading the charge towards a more sustainable future, not only with electric cars but with solar energy as well.
I just have 1 comment or suggestion regarding your plans for the sedan. From what I have been able to gather the proposed pricing is around $40k to $50k and the size is something along an Audi A4. I was hoping that within that price range you would be looking at something like a Mercedes E class or BMW 5 series or Audi A6.
I am currently driving a BMW 530. Great car, but I am hoping it is the last pure gasoline car I ever buy. It would be great if my next sedan were a Tesla….
I’m extremely excited about the possibility of an affordable model of these cars going mainstream. I’m also optimistic that by the time Tesla brings an affordable model to market, there will be improvements in battery technology (allowing more miles on a charge, and larger family oriented vehicles).
I’d love if you guys would put up something even as simple as Paypal for donations; there are plenty of average joes like me who would love to contribute to your R&D.
THANK YOU! Finally! A solution that will work. Now I can offer my children a glimmer of hope against global warming.
Conservation has never been the answer. Advancing technology is. I’ve always viewed the whole pollution problem as just an awkward phase that humans need to evolve past. Hybrids are too little too late. The big car companies should’ve done this a long time ago. It’s not rocket science. I only wish you guys could ramp up faster and gobble up market share. I’m sick of my medieval gas engine and I’m sick of oil. I can’t afford the roadster but I’ll be waiting in line for a family sedan when the price is competitive. I don’t really care what it looks like, I’ll buy it anyway.
By the way have you guys looked into EEStor? It’s supposed to be double the energy storage density of Li-Ion and it charges in 5 minutes. It was listed on Forbes as a disruptive technology. I’m surprised you guys weren’t listed too.
By the way, you made the right choice by not advertising. You don’t need to. I’m all the way out in Boston and I’m spreading the news like wildfire.
Thanks again. I hope you guys get filthy stinking rich for doing the right thing.
You might want to take a look at this very quick charge battery from Toshiba.
www.toshiba.co.jp/about/press/2005_03/pr2901.htm
I assume that you have also looked at Nikola Tesla’s rotary engine at the Tesla Engine Builders Association web site:
my.execpc.com/~teba/
Finally, you might consider that the fastest way to reduce CO2 produced by vehicles is to develop a tesla engine with quick charge batteries to be used by tractor - trailers. I believe that the trucking industry consumes half the fuel of the country, but the number of truck stops is only a couple of hundred thousand as opposed to millions of gas stations for passengar cars. Thus, if the “fueling structure” in this country needs any modification, then modifying the relatively smaller number truck stops should be a lesser challenge than modifying all the passenger vehicle gas stations.
Congratulations on what you have accomplished and congratulations for working towards goals that will benefit the world.
Barry Weintraub
Stafford, VA
Thank you.
This is capitalism with a soul. Corporate America please take a moment to acknowledge a business plan focused on profitability without losing site of humanity. Perhaps Tesla’s profits by 2020 will merely be $7 billion as opposed to $12 billion. What a disservice to their shareholders. What a terrible example of ruthless capitalism.
As a 24 year-old business person who works closely with Fortune 100 organizations, Tesla is a breath of fresh air (literally). I can only hope that my generation takes notice of the sentiment of your mission. You can make boat loads of money and “make the world a better place”. If I were on the West Coast I’d be at the front doors of Tesla pleading for a chance to join this type of organization… At the least, I’ll work on saving up enough to trade my 350z in for a Tesla Roadster later this decade.
Once again, to all involved with Tesla Motors, on behalf of my generation especially, thank you for setting this example.
Please hurry and build the affordable cars (I’ll be one of the first in line to get one)… But can you do me a favor? Keep them sporty like your original. It is an amazing car. Great job. Thats all. Thank you.
We, (the people of planet earth) are extremely pleased to see your company forming, and your world-changing product offering. I don’t know how you’re doing it (not being bought off or killed by the oil companies), but we are behind you 100%. I, for one, have told every one I know about you. Unfortunately I don’t know anyone with the means to purchase a vehicle at that price point. But I tell them about your plans to offer competitively priced family cars as soon as you can, and suggest that they generally promote you, etc. The one suggestion I have for you is to consider offering the roadster with half the battery pack, as soon as possible. I am sure it would increase (pre-order, pre-paid) sales for you to offer a vehicle that is cheaper, lighter, and higher performance, even though it would only go half as many miles on a charge. People really don’t care about that feature as much as you (or even they) think they do. Everyone I talk to understands immediately when I explain that the electric car will get its’ start with two car families, and that, replacing as many miles driven as possible, is the goal. Therefore, whichever member of the household has the long commute should drive the electric, even if it is too dead to use in the evening, after the long commute, they can just take the ICE car for the short drive out for the evening (or the long vacation trip). It’s great that you offer the 250 mile version, as it makes some of them take notice of ev’s for the first time, however, once they think it through, I feel they will opt for the 125 mile version every time. I think it will sell you more vehicles, and help us replace more miles driven, sooner. Thank you for all you are doing.
Elon,
Can you tell us how much energy (Watt-hours or whatever unit you prefer) your PV process uses to produce a watt of PV? Also, what is the lifetime (by some measure, perhaps 25% of rated output) of the cells? There are solar detractors who claim that it takes more energy to build a solar cell than the cell will produce over it’s lifetime. I’m looking to verify or refute this claim.
—-
Editor’s Answer: This is a great question! So great that the next blog article will address this in detail.
The emergence of the Tesla roadster is one of many pieces to a very complex puzzle…let me explain…
I am familiar with the genius technological breaktrhoughs of Nikola Tesla…one of which was the Tesla electric car…
The other was harnessing electricity from the ionosphere…
I was wondering if there are any plans to build Tesla towers in the future…as an infinite source of electricity to power your cars…
We know the technology exists.
Creating a plasma state in the ionosphere..H.A.A.R.P…
Success would mean two big blows to global warming…
So,
I suppose the question is, gentlemen,
why the secrecy?
I am in love with your Roadster. When my wife and I remodel in two years we will incorporate a 7 kilo-watt rooftop PV solar system. This will provide for both our home electric and our electric vehicle requirements. The total cost will be break-even, if not actually less, than conventional sources (the SDG&E grid and gasoline). And NO oil, NO hydrocarbon emissions.
I hope the electric car will be one of yours.
I want one, I want one, I want one … but I can’t afford $100,000 !
Please commence with the mass production of your vehicles. Get the price down into the ‘teens or low ‘twenties and you will have an overnight success story that will beat ALL entreprenuer stories.
Go man !
I’m sold. Please roll-out the sedan A.S.A.P.
Way to go! It seems obvious that you guys are among THE first to stand up on your feet and ride the wave of the future. I look forward to watching the company progress.
Valdez, you have your facts wrong, I made the same mistake at first too. Altiarnanp and PLI have made a remarkable breakthrough in lithium batteries, long cycle life and safety. These batteries are expected to last over 100,000 cycles compared to present day 1000 and be completely safe in fire and crash conditions. However they are not higher energy density, but actually less than the batteries used in the Tesla Roadster. They are equivalent to NiMH batteries in energy density. See www.polyplus.com for high energy, but that is still in development.
I hate to add fuel to the conspiratist theories but the fact is that the governments around the world make a HUGE amount of money off road tax. They collect this every time you fill up so it doesn’t hurt so much. Tesla Motors is proud to anounce that their car only costs 1 cent per mile, but the tax is about 6 cents per mile. The government is not going to give up this revenue. How are they going to collect it? They could let it accumulate and make you pay each time you renew your licence plate then you get hit with $600 tax for each 10000 miles driven. I know this makes the Tesla look worse because the true cost will be $0.07 per mile but you got to compare apples to apples and include road tax in your calculations.
A lot of people seem to be under the impression that electric motors are the same as gas in that smaller means more economical. Not true as pointed out by Tesla on this web site. Electric motor efficiency has to do with motor and controller design and a properly designed system can be over 90%. This is independent of motor size so there is no decrease in mileage cost by going to a smaller motor. But there is potentially more recovered energy during brakeing by a more powerful motor, so the increased re-generation would mean better economy for a bigger motor.
I really like where your company is headed. I hope you adhere to your main goals to provide low-cost, high-efficient EV’s to the everyday family. Are you hiring?
Editor’s Answer: Yes we are!
Can’t wait to hear more. I’ve been dying for a cool car that will make a blonde look great without harming our tiny planet.
Your master plan is brilliant. Any plans on integrating V2G into your vehicles for grid frequency regulation services? Especially with the E-7 time of use metering schedual, it seems that charging the car during off-peak and selling power during peak would pay for a Tesla owner’s electricity bill on its own… This could be a potential selling point to future consumers.
Keep up the great work!!
I have been following Tesla for the last five months. Last year I worked on Capitol Hill as an intern and researched alternative energies. I am also a Veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom and one who believes that our future security and prosperity as a nation is tied to technology just like this. I love what you are doing and as soon as I have enough money to purchase one of your amazing cars I assure you I will. Thank you for being innovative and having the guts to pursue this. You folks are the Preston Tucker’s of this generation. Fortune favors the bold.
How about some nice posters with bikini-clad hotties? I have space on my wall and you guys are my heroes.
—-
Editor’s surprise: Vin Diesel in a bikini? I don’t think so.
The Tesla company, is a new model of company that is designed with a concept of helping the individual learn to use their actions to claim back individual power. Most other companys have a goal based upon materialism, but Tesla believes in working with nature, not against it. Tesla’s energy feels so much better than most. It appeals to the intuitive side of man, and it is this type of thinking that will show others how to validate their idealism. Telsa can set new standards for others to observe and learn that they too can create such companies. And do it successfully.
To say that the Tesla Roadster produces zero emissions is misleading; yet to cut them by 80% is an excellent start.
MPG CO2Lbs/1000K BTU CO2 lbs/Mile Lifetime Miles CO2 lbs /Lifetime
06 911 Porsche Turbo 21.300 156.425 0.845 150,000 126682.218
Tesla Roadster 118.294 136.137 0.185 150,000 27761.184
Wow. Amazing! Im halfway through to my BS degree in Chemistry and willing to work for cheap once I get it!!
lol. you hiring?
—
Editor’s comment: Check out our employment page.
Wow, this looks very good! Please keep up the great work, the world needs it!
Now I only hope that a successful item about this car will be made on Top Gear.
( www.topgear.com )
If you make an affordable, reliable electric car (~20 to 40k), I’ll buy it for sure. Keep up the great work.
Joseph
Chesterfield, MO
Your CON comments on plug-in hybrids really don’t make any sense.
They involve scare tactics (gasoline is scary! Well, what about diesel/bio-diesel then?), non-issues (gasoline engine maintenance is not a practical or economic problem to the hundreds of millions of gasoline-powered cars on the road today) economic (from a group selling a 100K car, what Chutzpah!) and deflecting (no, I don’t think pulling a gasoline engine on a trailer makes any sense either). In general your argument would make a good example in a class on rhetoric on how to win an argument without foundation of fact on your side.
Let me propose a counter-argument. Tesla motors initiated conceptually, when, in 2004 or 2005? At that point, the founders either didn’t know about or didn’t understand the implications of plug-in hybrids. So they put together their plan and used their influence to get a good bit of cash together to build an all-electric car. And now, many millions of dollars spent into this process, they have to justify their path versus plug-in hybrids.
A plug-in hybrid is not a stepping stone technology. It is the final stone. Why? Because the cost of hauling around the batteries needed for the last 50 or 100 miles of all-electric operation (rarely used, but highly desired) cannot be justified compared with adding a small gasoline or diesel powered engine to provide the same additional range using fuel. The economics will never make sense unless and until batteries become free and weightless. And I don’t see that happening any time soon.
Mr. Musk,
Thank you for your interest in electric vehicles. Your intellect is needed on this difficult challenge. So it is with respect that I comment on your master plan.
1. You won’t make money on a sports car. No one seems to be able to do this. Not the Bricklen or the De Lorean, or any others. The EXISTING sport cars brands (Jaguar, Astin Martin, etc. are all money losers held by major automakers for prestige value.) There just aren’t enough people around that can afford $100,000 cars. You and the Page brothers should go out in cognito and hang around some Taco Bells or Target stores, and note how real world people have to live.
2. All-electric is a non-starter. To get a 100% electric car with satisfactory range, you need to devote 50% more resources (extra batteries) to get 5-10% more utility (range beyond 50 miles). This makes no sense, given that plug-in hybrids (PHEVs) are buildable today. Even if a PHEV had to use fully synthetic fuel, it would still be cheaper to operate overall than a fully electric vehicle. Why haul around 300 lbs and $40,000 in batteries you use 10% of the time? Better instead to haul around 150 lbs and $1500 in an engine that you use 10% of the time.
3. Don’t use NG in your calculations for electricity generation. Yes it doesn’t produce much CO2, but there simply isn’t enough of it around. North America is quickly running out of it and it is hard to ship in. You sound like you’ve been listening to CARB or EPRI too much. The rest of the world either burns coal or reacts Uranium to get their electricity. NG has no long term future in electricity generation.
4. Affordable (perhaps highly affordable) PHEVs can be built today. Heck, even I figured out how to do that. (beyer(at)novodynamics.com) A retrofit business (for Prius and Ford Escape hybrids) makes more sense as 90% of the car has already been built and tested by someone else. Yes, you can’t go more than 40 MPH all-electric, but again, that’s good enough for us average Joes that end up sitting in traffic daily rather than zipping around in our Ferraris.
Your presentation ignores relevant and important information.
For example, comparing farmland (biomass) to desert land (PV) is specious because the cost of the PV is completely ignored. An area of low quality farmland could grow switchgrass or other plant material at very low cost compared with constructing PV over a large area.
Yes, the H2 economy makes no sense. That is no big secret, or at least it shouldn’t be. Saying your system is superior to that is like saying I’m more honest than Ken Lay. True, but hardly illuminating.
You ignore the cost of batteries in your vehicles. They do cost something, don’t they? This needs some accounting in your comparisons, don’t you think? A 10 gallon gas tank in a vehicle costs maybe 20 bucks and can hold 70 kilowatt-hours of realizable energy using a gas engine. Given that, some fuel storage on a vehicle (i.e. plug-in hybrid) makes economic sense compared with hauling the last 50-100 miles of range capability around with heavy expensive, battery storage.
I cann’t wait to see the maintenance involved in running your vehicles.
It seems that the batteries are the crucial part of your vehicle and I hope you get a solution that would be both durable and effective. I also do not think that other manufacturers would sit idle waiting for you to produce the perfect transportation. It has been seen that high-level industrial competition does not hold back any of the means to achive the corporate goals.
Your idea is nice, however I expect to see you either:
1. Get absorbed by a mamooth car manufacturer
2. Get ridiculed by the same
3. Remain as an exotic car producer in very, very limited numbers
I wish I could sound as positive as you are, unfortunately, today’s world of economy is one big evolution of nothing, and revolutions such as yours are simply not permitted.
Hello there,
First things first …how do you pronounce your first name is it…. E (lawn) or E (lon)?
Secondly your “secret business plan” needs some tweaking drop me an email…it might enlighten you?
Adious amigo!
If I had a million I would give it all to you to help you make this work. To me you are the leading edge of saving our economy and way of life. When I think about the amount of money (billions) that have been spent on the war in Iraq and what that same money would have done if we had put it into the education system in America or into research for alternative fuel, where would we be now?
When Foxpro first came out with their database software, they had a cute term for purging the database. It was called “FLUSH”. We all had a little toilet handle symbol on our monitors as a joke…… They have changed it now because of the negative connotations it had, but that is what the efforts in Iraq remind me of and who can not wonder if it is not all about oil.
Keep up the good work and when the cars are down to the affordable level, I will buy two.
Cv
Seattle, WA
Brilliant product and if through Lotus you can start supplying them in Britain (in which the 250 mile range will be ideal for a lot of commuters who would also avoid the congestion charge in London for a zero emissions car) I’ll start running a car again instead of using our over-priced rail network.
Increasing the car’s range as soon as possible would be good and perhaps a union with ENV fuel cells would add to it ( www.envbike.com/ ) and harvesting the energy whilst braking back into the batteries too.
Editor’s comment: We’re using regenerative braking.
May I sincerely, and with best possible intentions, recommend that you (Tesla executives) and all your bloggers start to play the game of “spot the ’spoiler’ blog”, starting immediately? Here’s why, and what I mean by this:
A number of your (self-proclaimedly) learned blog contributors are beginning to question the value of Tesla’s contribution. The interventions of these ‘doubters’ fall into a number of clear categories which I’ll summarise as:
1 “You can’t succeed because no-one has ever succeeded at this (sports car making / battery-power / taking on the majors, etc etc) before”.
- May I commend to everyone Dava Sobel’s wonderful (and short!) book, “Longitude”, which offers a perfect map of the tendency of government and the scientific establishment collude to reject true innovation. This effect can only be overcome when a tipping-point of perceived popular utility is reached, at which point the establishment suddenly has a bout of collective amnesia about their earlier denials. (Same story many times over, historically, of course - from Gallileo onwards…)
2 “It’s inefficient to carry batteries around”. Rather as it’s inefficient to carry around a full tank of gas, perhaps? Or to carry around a SUV chassis which itself weighs a ton or more? (Come on, Detroit, you can find a better argument than that, surely?)
3 “This technology is not a solution and never will be.” This very much reminds me of the IBM’s famously short-sighted take on the prospect of home computing, back in the 70s. The language of these contributions, let alone their content, points to a thought-process rooted in volume-producers’ vested interests. Consider the successes of some other new-tech challengers of vested interests: Dyson taking on Hoover with a bagless vacuum-cleaner; Bayliss bringing clockwork (i.e. battery-less) radios and laptops to the third world; thin-film solar panels (sorry, can’t remember who, but you know who I mean). On this point, it was deeply depressing, at a high-level environmental science conference of the UK Government last year, for me to witness a “leading and respected” Professor of Transport rejecting electric traction out-of-hand with the words “it will never be more than just batteries on a trolley”. Given that this “expert” was advising ministers of state setting future national policy on alternative transport, my immediate thought was “Who pays this man’s research grant?”
So let’s be vigilant for any who claim, in a smooth way, that Tesla can’t possibly have the answers. From a position of some expertise in this field, may I remind readers that the “you-don’t-understand-how-our-industry-works” argument has been the policy instrument of choice for numerous corporate fraudsters and protectionists down the ages (Enron, anyone?). New York’s energetic DA, Mr Spitzer, has made a fine career out of challenging such thinking in the finance sector (with the simple rejoinder: “WHY does your industry work like that? Against customer choice?”). And then of course there’s the entire consumer movement (remember Flaming Fords? remember “Unsafe at Any Speed”?). We can and should ask the same questions of the conventional auto industry.
The good news is that genuine innovation will out - as long as ordinary consumers are able to find it and buy it. One of the early lessons of the twentyfirst century, thank goodness, is that the old-school, browbeating style of corporate communication - terrorising one’s customers into rejecting alternatives - increasingly fails as people wise up to making decisions based on their own independently-gathered information about benefits and risks. (Interestingly, a popular reaction against “selling by fear” is also now happening in the political field. Now why might that be?) As a consumer, one doesn’t have to agree with the in-ya-face techniques of anticorporate critics like Michael Moore and Morgan Spurlock to still subscribe to the view that we can buy what we want to buy. We no longer want to be told by old-tech that new-tech is inherently suspect. Isn’t it old-tech that brought us dependency on oil, climate change, wars over energy sources?
So c’mon people, how about a reward system for “spot the spoiler”? I’m all for free debate on the issues, but some of these blogs smell rather like the work of paid old-tech corporatists trying to sabotage your success. Challenge such interventions with the greatest possible vigour, and let consumers decide for themselves!
I do like the Tesla design, nice car.
Is the Government trying to cause problems with your Electric Car?
They don’t want any thing that they can’t make money on.
Lets be clear about one thing and that is The Government want control with all energy type of stuff.
Look into Stanley Meyer with the fuel cells, they killed him and a week later the government went into his home and took every thing !
The same happen to Tesla too, in the 40s.
I want us all to work together on solving the energy problems, Its ok to make money just how much is the question!
Good luck to all that want free energy.
Tom.
I am for free debate as well. And I want our vehicles (and everything else) to use energy sources that we don’t have to import. And I do want Tesla motors to succeed, as well.
That’s why I am asking why they did not consider a plug-in or pluggable hybrid configuration. A lot (but not all) of the hard stuff has been done, including the planetary gear gadget that allows both engine and electric power to move the wheels. Yes, dual power systems are kind of a bother, but so is $10,000 worth of battery pack, especially when competing (low-end) vehicles need to sell for $10,000 - $15,000 for the whole car.
Tesla reasons for not pursuing PHEVs is not clear to me, and remain so.
To launch this car to the public I would like to see a promotion like it driving from Canada to Mexico, or Darwin to Adelaide in Australia.
The Paris Dakar Rally gets a lot of media.
Do we have any promotional tour ideas folks?
Michael
As you move forward, I would think you could also bring the Roadster further into the mass-market affordability range as production capability is realized. More units produced > lower unit cost > more demand as more people can afford one > still more reduction in unit cost. The sedan becomes an option for middle class families and the “more affordable” third presumably similar to an economy model that singles & commuters would own. I am confident that you guys understand market appeal, which is highly encouraging that the third model won’t be a Yugo look-alike
We may not “need” another sports car, but how much of our economy and living habits in the 21st century are “need” vs. “want” at this point? Do I really need a HDTV & DVD player? I have read some of your other writings and wholeheartedly agree with you that space is a necessary step in our “evolution” and survival long term. But its not need that will put us there, its want. I want to get us there as well, and if the rate of survival on space shuttle launches was only 1/3 times getting back alive there would still be millions behind me in line to go. Not because we needed to… And when private spacecraft are somewhat common (likely well after I am dust) I’d make a substantial wager they look a lot more like XWings than TIE Fighters as well for other reasons than just aerodynamics.
Making a sports car, even if & when they are the most affordable cars on the market, was the right choice. If it’s only a 2-seater and can only hold a limited amount of cargo - it better look good. Otherwise the market shrinks a lot because as I noted somewhere else - a great many people don’t want to drive a “golf cart” or “Kiddie Kar” down the highway or to the store. There is no reason why a car *shouldn’t* look and perform well other than the marketing use of justifying the cost of a better-looking and performing model (like say a Dodge Neon vs. a Challenger - by the time they pass 100,000 units or more are the costs so greatly different?).
I’d like to someday own one of your cars. In that vein I’ve always favored a sports car, if I need hauling ability, I have a crew cab truck. The next question is when will we see 4X4 EVs capable of hauling trailers etc on the mass market?
As for accessories, a trickle charger mounted in the roof panel would likely provide a way of commuter recharge while the car sits in a parking lot (and I believe you actually have that as an option somewhere if I recall correctly). For home charging, I just mounted a 3.4Kw array on my home here in Colorado for a net cost of just under $6k by the time the subsidies & tax credits come in. Doing that again in 2007 I’d have enough energy on average at my house to power both the home and an EV for almost all my usage (in fact I calculated out a roughly $200-400 a year profit in net metering with a 7Kw array for my projected use if I had an EV to charge with it). If the cars were affordable to the average consumer now with the subsidies in place in various areas there are several thousand families that would be “energy positive” in short order. That soon would get noticed and the arrangement would quickly catch on to be mainstream in most urban/suburban settings. The cost factor would be the resistance to this flow of change as not everyone has subsidies available in their area, and those in existence will dry up in time.
As to the current makeup of our power grid, I work at a coal fired generating station nearing 50 years in age. We can’t not run - the generation capacity is needed at least in the peak times, and startup & shutdown times means we must run 24/7 if we are to run at all. My own thoughts are: learn to love the atom. If we as a nation were smart about placement we would be able to use nuclear power for hundreds of years to come with much less effect on the overall environment (localized contamination yes, but there are solutions like storing waste in a dispersed state in a neutral medium underground for later recovery and reconcentration when that becomes economically viable). Solar power is a good augmentation and reduction of overall energy needs for some applications. Wind power is also good when it’s available. Hydro is outstanding, but it does have effects on waterways and surroundings that the same people that picket a nuke plant cry over if you try to dam up a river. There is also a limited amount of hydro generation opportunities based on water flow and elevation drop. Nuclear is the only mass demand substitute for the combustion of carbon fuels to generate energy - for motive or any other uses. Unfortunately its a tough sell, but I can tell you that I’d rather just avoid going in an inner containment vessel and use remote robotics to handle rods than deal with coal dust, ash and the myriad other accommodations (chemicals) necessary to attempt to cleanly burn coal. That change would take the mileage and carbon reduction ratings of your EVs out of sight.
The columns of the table should be labelled “Carbon Content” and “Carbon Emissions”, not “CO2 Content” and “CO2 Emissions”. The 14.4 g/MJ and 19.9 g/MJ figures are correct, but these are for Carbon content, not CO2. To convert to CO2 multiply by 44/12 (the atomic mass of CO2 divided by the atomic mass of Carbon).
The DOE provides detailed CO2 emissions report for electricity generation in the US broken down by region: www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electricity/page/co2_report/co2report.html Table 4 shows that the US average in 1998 was 1.35 pounds of CO2 per kilowatt hour, or 46 g/MJ of Carbon. The Pacific states do much better at .417 pounds/kilowatthour or 14.3 g/MJ, which interestingly is almost exactly the carbon content of natural gas. So driving a roadster in California using grid electricity emits about 12.6 grams of carbon/km, just as you show in the table above. However, on a national average, driving a roadster emits 40.4 grams of carbon per km, which is a little worse than the Prius. Still better than an ICE vehicles of course, so I am not contradicting your statements, just adding some useful data.
Combining personal solar electricity generation with electric vehicles leads to many beautiful synergies, and I’m thrilled you guys have the vision and the resources to turn it into a reality. Keep up the amazing work.
Thank you so much for naming your company for my hero. If i ever come back in another life, i want his brain, i am sure that even in the conditon it is in today it would be much, much better than what i have?
Monte
I want to invest in Tesla Motors…What is the symbol?
—
Editor’s response: Tesla Motors is a privately-held company.
I just wanted to say that I am quite impressed. I just watched “who killed the Electric Car” and was motivated to find out what is being done to break away from the big car companys and big oil! I even wondered what it would take to start an independant car company when my girlfriend sent me your website. Thank you for what you are doing… and I hope someday to actually be able to afford one of your vehicles (hopefully a pick-up and jeep like vehicle is in the master plan?!)
PS…. I put one of your banners on my MYSPACE page.
just wonder ing what is the stock symbol for these cars
Elon -
I hope you’re checking the comments once in awhile. I’d love to have a Tesla Roadster (and yes, I could afford one), but I simply can’t fit. I’m 6′5″ tall, and the specs on the cockpit (especially the head/legroom) are just too cramped.
I just bought a 2006 Lancer Evolution IX…a sporty four-door sedan that fits my lifestyle (one young child). I’d like to look seriously at your 4-door sedan, but it REALLY needs to have enough head- and legroom for me. If it’s too tight, I simply can’t consider it, much as I might like to. As you know, the average height of Americans is growing every year, so the more you can accommodate the 95th percentile today, the better (as we’ll be the 70th percentile in 5-10 years).
I really WANT to go green…I was hoping you were partnering with Nanosolar, as I think they have the best chance of really bringing down the cost of residential solar energy. But I applaud your efforts in any case, and hope that I can join in with your next-generation vehicle.
Hi Elon,
You’ve created a really cool car and your company has a very honorable mission. It’d be really nice to see your car this weekend at the 2007 San Jose International Auto Show. Can you bring a few by? Maybe let us have a test drive?
Thanks for all the hard work
-Ken
hey guys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I’m doing a fundraiser for my school, my goal is to buy a solar panel at the end of the year to generate the main office, i dont know which solar panel to buy, i am wondering which one i can get for around $400.00 post on my blog. thedoors.learnerblogs.org/
A genius with a vision, a man with a purpose to save ourselves from ourselves . I salute a man with a vision…This technology will be needed for the future we are creating for ourselves…we are turning a corner where we will embrace all thing green…where we will see the beauty that we are loosing, and be compelled to act…..
I beleive that the whole idea behind the Tesla roadster is amazing as well as the vision of the future. If i had the money right now i would buy it immediately. i live in brooklyn NY and drivee to work every day….the air is so halibut polluted that you can’ t even open my windows. I work at the hospital in pediatric department and yesterday I found out that 100.000 childeren here in Brooklyn have asthma,,,,,if we do not surpport ideas and concepts such as those of Tesla Motors soon we will be walking around in space suits scking oxygen through a mask.
And guys please hurry up with this …more afordable model:)
Furhter to the Fortune magazine article - recently published a list of the world’s largest companies (according to revenue)
1. Exxon Mobil
2. Wal-Mart Stores
3. Royal Dutch Shell
4. BP
5. General Motors
6. Chevron
7. DaimlerChrysler
8. Toyota Motor
9. Ford Motor
10. ConocoPhillips
The majority of what we pay for gasoline is in tax revenue to the government, the biggest benefactor from the status quo. As my friend at Kodak used to say, “The purpose of a camera … is to sell film!” Lets not forget the purpose of the automobile…to sell gasoline, that’s where the real money is. So don’t expect any of the above referenced companies to help break our oil habit any time soon. The United States, India, China, Canada and Australia can’t even commit to a 5% greenhouse gas emission reduction in ten years!
Now we find out releasing hundreds of millions of years of carbon reserves into the atmosphere and oceans over the last 200 years is the biggest threat to the survival of life on this planet to the end of this century. What are we going to do about it? We need to transition away from Fossil fuels over the next ten years completely, not just the 5% of the Kyoto Accord if we are to survive. We all need to start driving electric cars and concentrate on producing electricity without fossil fuel.
Wie Geht’s??
With 33.3 years of automotive industry experience, I would like to place an order for your first Tesla vehicle. We developed the hybrid concept some fifteen years ago and placed in on the shelf, when gas was selling at .75 per gal. Congress, the House of Rep, is about to cut the generous tax credits to the oil & gas industry, with the intent to channel those resources into alternative fuel and transportation concepts. This is the correct direction, over the long run. Keep up the good work!
Danka, Thomas H. Semelbauer - Kalamazoo, Michigan
Hey, im doing a report on your car for a project at my highschool. What type of engine is used in the roadster.
A quick question for Tesla — if you have a 4-door sedan in mind next (I assume 4 passenger capacity) what platform are you thinking about to develop?? The Lotus chassis doesn’t seem logical — is there a partner you have in mind???
like everyone one else I need to buy I car but I won’t until an electric car in my budget will come out . I made a promise to myself that will do with it until . I will not buy a regular car any longer . SO when ……..!!!!!
Is Tesla motors using United Laboratories (UL) standardized electronic components? Nickoli Tesla invented a type of natural atmospheric static electricity that was harnessed into free energy that was transmitted and recieved wirelessly from towers to the public at large. Henry Ford used the Dodge Brothers manufacterers of car parts to mass produce an assembly line produced automobile, For $300.00 bucks (approx. 2 years of available income) the average American could get the famous “model A”, back then a first rate vehicle, then after a few years the famous “model T”, bigger and better. Likewise in the early seventies Honda’s first car had a 750cc motorcycle engine, NOW look at Honda’s cars. The (UL) standardized electricity is a bottleneck technology, inhibited by politics, capitolism and the social elitists that keep the common public good, equal to their bank statments, where would we be if a lightbulb lasted 30 years or where would general electric be if a lightbulb lasted 30 years. The oil industries have invented a formula of 1 part raw petro fuel and 5 parts natural H2O in a relatively easy process to create 6 gallons of gasoline. Where is the public good now, the jobs people must have to survive this day and age, this is our delimma, AND THE PEOPLE KNOW IT. My Question To You Is This: Are you able to take these blogs seriously and provide the American People with The Way Forward out of this delimma, If we as Americans can pull together and create an economy where corporations can survive on thier own merits instead of on the backs of middle class ( and lower ), then Tesla Motor’s can first build a car that Real American’s (like Homer Simpson and Hank Hill) will make great, The public at large is what makes America great AND THE PEOPLE KNOW IT. Be the TESLA of a hundred years ago, use his technology, use his vision, use the wisdom from the true Era of Inventors, and your legacy will find its place in history. Thank you for allowing this open forum, Sincerly Brian Nightingale.
The environmental studies building at my College (Oberlin)
www.oberlin.edu/ajlc/ajlcHome.html
runs completely on solar power on a yearly basis. (i.e. used more energy than it produces in the winter and produces more energy than it uses in the summer, so it comes out ahead.) On the website is a paper discussing the cost/payback of PV power. As it turns out PV panels save more greenhouse gases than it took to produce them after 3 years of use and save more energy than in took to produce them after 7 years of use. Unfortunately (At current rates and in most situations) they dont yet make money. (i.e. they cost more to install than the electricity they produce over their lifetimes is worth) But this is only assuming cheap electricity for the next 35 years and even then they still come pretty close. This will probably change within the next decade as PV becomes a profitable (if only marginally) investment for the average homeowner. (This of course ignores the externalities and hidden costs of fossil fuels, if we had to pay for those upfront, PV would be cheaper already.)
Congratulations! Solar is the way to go! I am ready with my $20,000 for the first reasonable little electric car that comes along.
I have not searched properly, but does anyone know how I can track production of, and possibly reserve a 4-door Tesla?
—
Editor’s response: We currently are taking reservations for the Tesla Roadster on our Buy page. For information on future models (including the four-door “WhiteStar” sports car), read our Secret Master Plan.
If you sell em in the UK, maybe you could offer an incentive scheme to owners to spread the word and encourage new advance orders. From what I heard about the RAV4 EV several people a day came up to their drivers and wanted to know about what it could do, where they could buy one, etc. If these drivers got some kind of bonus like airmiles or vouchers towards another Tesla EV they would serve to accelerate the already heady demand for these types of vehicles in old Blighty, where a few hundred miles is the maximum range before driving off a coastline anyway, and where fuel costs £0.90/$1.80 per LITRE. I own a mondeo, but would buy an EV equivalent with a loan if need be to make the switch cos the only time I travel long distance is for pleasure, and I can use trains, planes and maybe Infernal Combustion Engines for hire to do that. Or a plug-in EV hybrid with a petrol powereed range extender to power the electric motor.
Save Europe again please!
Hey, if anyone gets their hands on practical EVs please would they send their petrol car to the crusher for all to see. It may be a loss of money now, but as EVs take off and the technology evolves to cater for all driving needs those old petrol cars are gonna become obselete and valueless real fast. Does anyone sell VHS tapes anymore when they get a dvd replacement for their movies or do they just junk em/give em away? If family/hatchback type EVs get as good as the roadster petrol cars will become as worthless as VHS tapes very quickly. Itd be funny to watch GM execs faces if people shred their petrol cars en-masse lol!
NB Leeds is the best place in England UK to sell EVs because a) its in a nice central location for England, and b) because I live there loL!
Folks,
Tesla’s fully green approach is on the right track. It attains the multiapplication for automobile transportation.: Commuter at more than 35mph and longer trips at speed. As soon as you develop your more affordable vehicles and a five passemger commuter version you make a giant leap down the right path. This will also be great for typical family transportation needs. We need to study automobile uses eg. miles driven for various trip types and passenger loads to quantify the consumers’ needs.
I see value in additional technological integration in your vehicles. Put the electric motors in the wheel hubs with the wheel acting as the motor’s rotor like the large ore haulers. This eliminates the transmission and drive train further reducing petrochemical dependance. Can have motors in two or four wheels (operate only two in specific circumstances for efficiency). The only moving parts are the wheels. More room/weight for batteries, ad naseum.
Thabks for your great job so far.
Phil
—
Editor’s response: Take a look at the blog, Balance.
Hello Tesla,
I am patiently waiting for a four door sedan/hatch Tesla commuter car. The day where I can buy one cant come soon enough.
Oh yeah, make it around $25k please.
What happened to the kid who invented the motor in his basement that had no emissions? I think you should find him and use that tec to. In the future I would like to see a car that works good, don’t have to refuel, and don’t have to pay for expensive parts and labor. That would be the ultimate car, less trips to the mechanic. Over the last 6 years I have had my “formerly new” car I spend enourmous amounts on oil changes, up keep, broken electrical parts, brake systems……..Please make good electrical parts. You will beat them all out if you make your consumer happy! We spend billions on mechanics, please help!
Oh god thank you master of the clean skys. Please hurry and get something my poor butt can afford. Average Joes need the ability to be clean too.
~Chris
Tesla Motors shows a sleek, stylish, and robust new automobile with the new roadster. Those of us who are part of the lower end of society cannot wait to see an EV subcompact/compact sedan on the road that just says sturdy, economic and Cool, did I say Cool? Yes a Cool Car that we can possibly play around with and modify =). It would be nice to be one of those EV drivers in the future smiling content to know that we made the right choice because we wouldn’t have to wait in long lines…tortured that we found the cheapest price for gasoline in the city bewildered that someone shot us an angry rude stare. Possibly keep those nasty toxics out from our lungs too!!! So keep it silent, keep it smooth we are watching and we will see you at the dealership
You guys really rock man… Please come to Singapore… The oil price is a killer here…
I can not wait for the “affordable to the masses” model, and I can not stress enough how much I hope that you do not sell out before this vision is reached. I’m glad that you already have more money than god
it should allow you to stick to your principles and vision a little easier. I wish Tesla the best of luck, but I’m glad they have a solid business minded chairman that may not even need luck.
Congratulations! Finally a “real” electric car is produced and available !! Not just this hybrid junk .. I wish, someone here in Germany would have had the guts to do the same as Tesla Motors. As soon as I can afford one of your cars (in the pipe) I will definetly buy one.
It feels good to see this kind of things emerge from the US, despite — you know.
Tons of luck and may Tesla Motors prosper and grow as fast as possible!
Cheers,
Matthias
Thank you Tesla Motors. I will be purchasing a new car in the next 8-10 months. Get in that pipeline. Average Janes need to be able to afford a car like this too. I have a dream to breathe. Breathing is highly under rated. I have a dream to stay out of the entire Bush, Exxon, foreign oil quagmere as much as I can. Does it really matter if global warming is real or not? (I think it is) We should be cleaning up this mess anyway. I’m sick of the daily reports of Exxon’s record profits made off my back. I’m gonna go hug a tree now, while I still can.
This info on the technology is impressive. I think you guys could come up with a series hybride for a larger offroad vehicle or passenger van type. From what I have read I am not optomistic about ethanol, wind or solar power in the near decade. We will still be tied to fossile fuel and nuclear alternatives for some time. Most Kyoto countries are realizing this as they fail their emmissions targets. Coal dervied synfuels mixed with cellolouse ethanol will probable be the mainline for gas fuel vehicles. Hydrogen is not yet viable or economical and there are problems with storage and transport. Fuel cells are not yet economical for present auto drivers due to membrane materials and fabrication.
Nuclear has been made very safe and Chernobyl was a water cooled graphite modulated reactor design not used in most other countries, especially not in the US. It blew up due to poor management, running experiments that would have been prohibited anywhere else and a lack of safety oversite. This type of reactor is not used stateside as it is a inheritantly dangerous reactor design. The Soviets were using it then primarily for weapons material production. Three Mile Island never was in danger of breaching containment.
And although I can’t argue with advantages of going to an electric automobile, global warming is not the best reason. Global warming is due to the suns variance and the melting polar ice on MARS proves it. Just look up ‘The Deniers’ on www.canada.com. We are just in the peak off the current warming phase and the begining of the next ice age is about 10 years from now which means we better start preparing for it and peak oil now!
I think Tesla Motors along with other auto manufactuors are heading somewhat in the right direction. I hope incentives rather then government mandates are stressed as the bureaucracies tend to screw things up more then they solve. Just because gas is realatively inexspensive at the present time does not guarentee it in the near future and price controls will only make worse. So make plans now.
As mentioned in an earlier posting: ” The purpose of a camera - is to sell film”. An apt quote. And how much film gets sold now? The Tesla seems a perfect analogy to the digital camera. No more film - an entire industry eliminated within 10 years. And how much resistance did they put up? Not a great deal, primarily because those film manufacturers had the foresight to jump on the digital bandwagon!
My first reaction: Stunned! I am both excited and anxious for your sedan model and would be willing to pay a premium for the technology (with the offset in fuel and maintenance costs ultimately mitigating the lifecycle costs, of course!).
I am very disappointed that I had not heard of this company or its vision sooner, I happened to find the website while looking for an EV conversion company to convert my Honda.
My personal background: I work for the second largest Nuclear utility company in the country as a Nuclear Engineer and I can speak to our safety record and lack of emissions (truly environmentally friendly and cost competative, take note Wall Street). Nothing would please me more than to be able to purchase an electric car and drive it to work to ‘plug in’ at my plant.
I will be glad to answer any questions from bloggers on nuclear waste or safety as this is the prevaling issue today and I don’t take it personally if I have to defend issues based on technical grounds (no fear mongering please).
I have a few comments on some of the blog content:
1. As a matter of simplicity our approach to energy management in our world as a whole needs to focus on consolidation rather than to decentralize generation and utilization (as is the plan with the illusion that is the Hydrogen Economy). How far does the rabbit hole go?
a. eliminate fossil fuel searh teams and equipment research
b. eliminate drills and the companies that make them
c. eliminate transport mechanisms and pipelines
d. eliminate refineries
e. eliminate ship super tankers
f. eliminate storage tankers
g. eliminate gas stations (employees, corporations, inspectors, etc.)
h. eliminate oil and combustible fuel stations (Jiffy Lube, bye bye!)
i. eliminate combustible repair stations and part stores
j. eliminate combustible part companies, factories, etc.
an on and on and on….
2. Regulatory oversight and technological advancement can then be concentrated on the pollution problems of our electrical generators. Real scrubbers for coal, carbon sequestration, Spent Nuclear Fuel reprocessing, complete emissions elimination (forget about carbon credits and caps), LNG terminals and transport solutions, hydro environmental impacts, etc. These are real problems that we can focus on rather than LA smog.
3. Mass production of your sedan EV vehicle could be accompanied by a modular repair program, where you simplify the electrical board components and battery replacements to a plug-and-play format. Include redudant and diverse systems to accomodate failures and have a mail-in program for part replacement (don’t perpetuate the repair shop hijacking we are in now).
4. A real customer feedback design process and make cars that are reliable, safe, efficient, and look good.
Response to Mr. Santiago Velez :
I believe that we should let the marketplace dictate how much oil this country, or any other, should consume. If it makes economical sense for people to buy electric plug-in cars they will. If the government were to dictate what technology auto manufactures were to use everyone would have to deal with more expensive cars (implementing new technology costs money). I am, however, in favor of a Pigovian tax on gasoline. This would bring us closer to an optimal level of gasoline consumption by making people realize the negative externality caused by burning gasoline (social costs associated with burning gasoline). I have seen no evidence that electric plug-in cars are CURRENTLY less expensive on a levelized bases for the average consumer. I believe this is why Tesla Motors is currently working on improving this technology, for this will be essential if they plan to appeal to the general public with their next car. As to the mention of bringing pollution to zero, thats just ridiculous. I believe that you are only looking at the benefits of abating pollution and ignoring the costs. Any economist will tell you that to reach an optimal level of pollution abatement you need to consider both the social costs and the social benefits of pollution abatement (it does cost money to get rid of pollution). I should note that it is generally understood that an optimal level of anything (taking into account all the benefits and costs) is best for society as a whole. With that said I hope that Tesla Motors is successful in developing new technologies to make battery cars economically viable for the average American.
-Justin Appenzeller
[contact information removed]
I continue to be so excited about The Tesla. I have been dragging my feet about giving my downpayment because of the cost. However, the more I think about it, I think that I do not want to waste any more time. I want to be a part of making history by buying and driving the first car that is good for the planet , beautiful and super fun to drive. Usually the only things I regret in life are the things I do not do.
Jennifer Helland
Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You have really got something here. An ausome product line and a company that is well put together with quality people to solve the issues of a start up auto co, which sounds more than start up now. I think you are going to give the big guys a run for the money as far as electrics are concerned. You have the range and the performance people don’t want to give up by owning an electric. You also have great styling in the roadster. Don’t loose that sports mindedness for the 4 door. You won’t be able to build enough of them. Let me know when you have specs on the 4 door. I’d like to buy one. Any thought of doing a stock offering so smaller invertors can get involved? Or do you have an investment plan already set up? Let me know. I’m interested.
Dave Carlton
As the owner of 2 Priui, I am ready and waiting for better. Tesla is that next better thing, far better thought out than anything else out there. If you build that less expensive model, I’m there with checkbook. The demand is backed up like everything and waiting to explode.
The trouble with big splashes is that everyone notices and the oil companies and big Governent will be big losers with the Tesla splash. India and China will drive the oil prices and take their eye off the ball, but the losers will not let you get away too far from their revenue streams. Hence here in the UK we have a road pricing scheme based on a tax charge for the number of miles driven!. Yep, number of miles driven. Irrespective of the power source. gas, electric, bio fuels. Its being tested now and will eventually replace the duty on fuel as the technology works and tax revenues drop. Look out for it over here in the US. Dont get slammed. Meanwhile quietly introduce the vehicles to as many of the enlightened and caring as you can. I want these cars to succeed and all over the world, but big business has made me a little cynical. Good luck and when can we buy them in the UK?. I already run the Prius but its only a halfway house.
I live in Vegas. Where can I test drive a Tesla car?
—-
Editor’s Answer: I have forwarded your details to the sales team.
Godspeed your mass market vehicle, iteration 3 (for me). I hope you are being carefull not to get sidelined by oil interests as you get closer to being disruptive to the mass market, so that you can make it and so that we can survive as a species.
Maybe groups of us potential $20,000 sedan buyers could join forces to buy a shared $100,000 car to speed up the progress to iteration 3. For most drivers with family to transport a sportscar is not ideal ( though beautiful) but could cram the kids in somehow if it helps!
Hey!
I think you guys have a great product and a very good marketing strategy. However I would suggest that you keep the Tesla Roadster image pricey through and through. Maybe even come up with more features for the same car keeping it a luxury and sport comodity, even making it more expensive possibly. I would suggest expanding both ways simultaneously. Into more expensive and more affordable models. This will help you speed the recovery of investments.
In the case of the average customer, I understand you are headed to completely change the configuration of the existing automative market. You definately have a great start a changing the perception we have of electric vehicles simply by launching a sports car. Thats a brilliant way to go! You could also go a step further than most car companies and even offer a buy back of cars and yourself recycle or dispose its parts as fit. Who would know better about all that in a new market than you.
Overall you guys are headed in the right direction and at the right time. I wish you ALL THE BEST!! If I was able to afford the roadster, I’d pay my desposit right now! Until then. However, if I cannot afford one about 7 years from now, please offer me a job!
Best Wishes,
Komal Bajaj
I’m psyched.
Have you considered High Alt. Wind Generation. This link will tell you more:
www.skywindpower.com/ww/index.htm Let’s go fly a kite… generator and get this show on the road.
SIncerely,
Paul Habib
Amazing acheivement, proof that environmentally friendly doesnt have to be boring.
Wish you all the best though it doesnt seem you need it. With high levels of electric vehicles acting as grid balancing systems when not in use, plenty of local renewable generation available, and a high capacity nuclear grid in high demand areas we can have a far more efficient and sustainable way of life and still have all the funky high tech stuff that we all love. This is only a taste of whats to come!!
Thanks to you all and everyone else who has made positive comments and wants a new future
I’m in Los Angeles, California and i have to tell you that I’m very much at peace knowing that there is hope for future generations to have a better living enviroment by eliminating pollution.
I was very dissapointed when General Motors eliminated their own electric cars in the late 90s and the last of thier cars in 2003.
I really think that you can make history with your much better improved electric car, but please be careful with the Government of the United States we all know they don’t want electric cars because of their greedyness for $$$$$$$$$$$$.
I agree with everyone that your concept has a lot of potencial. Please save the U.S and the rest of the world from Global Warming. This is why I highly appreciate everybody at Tesla Motors.
Can you please hurry and come up with a much affordable car!!!. I’m twenty-two years old and I promise to save up $$$ to buy one of your cars. I would purchase the Tesla Roadster, but can afford it right now.
Thank for everything- I have research paper coming up about electric cars and I will sure mention Tesla Motors, I want everyone to know about you guys.
WISH YOU THE BEST AND WHATEVER HAPPENS PLEASE KEEP YOUR CARS ON THE MARKET.
P.S My boyfriend is a Mechanical Engineering major and would like to work for Tesla Motors some day. Please advise requirements:) Talk to you guys later!
Love Ya!
Brenda
I have a modified track version of the Elise and love what you guys have done with the Tesla platform. I am planning a large Solar array at home and would like to integrate a REAL(sub $50K) electric vehicle into my daily routine(50 miles total). I would prefer a small hatchback or wagon along the lines of the Golf five door or the Jetta Wagon. I have been disapointed in the quality of the current electric car offerings out there. I am very interested in making a commitment to a renewable energy source.
this is fantastic…. one piece of advise….PLEASE PLEASE… move away from a black background and white font. this post is absolutely unreadable…
Chart gives too much effiiciency to the FCX. Must be something wrong with the calculation or dealing with a pre-charged batteries. FCX does use the batteries heavily since hydrogen doesn’t have enough umph. 1 KG of Hydrogen needs at the minimum 2KG of CNG.
Do you have a page for your planned sedan (WhiteStar?), or for the production facility in the US that is being opened? I’ve read the press releases and stories in the press, but it would be nice to see a dedicated page (or even a blog) that describes the progress towards this goal.
Even if you haven’t made any progress toward the goal, this would still be a way to help build hype. I’m sure that the Roadster is still your focus, but a page about the sedan might help to build your “brand identity.” Knowledge of your long-term goals might also encourage people to buy the Roadster as a way of supporting the sedan (funding R&D etc) and the long-term vision for widespread availability of electric vehicles. For example, I’ve been reading stories and news about the Tesla Roadster once every 2-3 weeks on my weekly radio show. Any time I hear about important news, I mention it, if only briefly. I’ve also created a page on my website (treesong.org/electric) that tracks my progress toward owning an electric vehicle, with the Tesla Roadster being the ultimate goal. If you had something — however small — that was specifically for the planned 2nd model, I could read more stories about that on the air and put it in the mid-range of my list of electric vehicles that I’m saving up for. Others would do similar things, thus aiding in overall brand identity development .
Thanks in advance for any info, and thanks for the work that you do! I never thought I’d be rooting for a sports car, but as soon as I heard about the Tesla Roadster, I was on board and spreading the news. I guessed at your motives and strategy described above before you even articulated them, and I was happy to see that this is indeed what you’re going for. I’m aspiring to get a Tesla Roadster myself somehow, but if I can’t get together the funds, I will surely be on board for the sedan when the time comes.
—-
Editor’s Answer: Check out this blog article about the New Mexico facility.
As quite a few of the postings have indicated, many people around the world will surely dontate to Tesla Motors because they believe in the cause but cannot yet afford the buy the car. Let us give you money… you will need all the momentum possible to infuse American and the world with such an amazing product.
I have a water purifying device, using 2, 9 volts batteries. I am looking for a good longest lasting environmentally friendly battery, and a small solar battery or pack to power these water systems. The 2 -9 volt batteryies presently last about 2 hours working well with constant use
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Alpha W. King
My goal is True Sustainable development. Which starts with Water for all.
Alpha.
Hey guys,
Have you thought about installing a wind powered turbine generator that can augment the battery power? With today’s super magnets and generator technology, it should be feasible to do so. This could extend the range of a charge and at highway speeds might even keep the batteries charged.
—-
Editor’s Sigh: Take a look at an earlier blog from Martin where this question is addressed.
Wish I could afford a roadster, but I can wait until the sedans come along.
I would like to hear how you will address economic viability of energy companies after this shift. i would think that most of them won’t have the resources or talent to transform their business. massive unemployment and abandonment of capital investment would result if there is no transition plan for those companies. it would require analysis and acceptance by those companies or the road will be an uphill one with obstacles not necessarily related to the achievability of the vision.
Would like some info on investing in this company. Is it privately held? Camille Raulston
Has there been a IPO if so what is the symbol for the Co. Thanks
Would like some info on investing in this company. Is it privately held?
For the recreational market, electric trail motorcycles could go many places the noisy bikes can’t go.
Hi, can anyone tell me if tesla motors stock is available to the public??
Thank you!
Environmental responsibility and a touch of luxury is an irresistable combination. Just where and when can I get hold of one here in Germany? Is there a European based sales point or do I have to import?
I am exsited about the Tesla Rodester and look forwerd reading more .as for the Price of this car and what is Ide by in a secint aspeshely at this time in histrey . I want to live in a soler eltirc econemy and this is one step in that .I have bin hopeful that somone would inginer a powertern replacement paceg for a fue of the popler model
Tesla Motors, I applaud you deeply. I’m looking forward to the chance of buying your third-series model when it comes out and am highly anticipating the day when I’ll be able to drive that car, powerful and enivronmentally-friendly and all! Keep up the awesome work you are doing! I’ve already told 6-7 people about you already!
Tesla Motors, you’re the best! The “smog” has lifted. As soon as I am able, I will be driving only EV’s. Tell EVERYONE about your Master Plan. I tell people about your company every chance I get. Most recently, I brought you up at a party, and much to my delight, people knew about you, and even more than myself. I’ve even started a Facebook group about your company. Build the cars, save the world……
im going to have to drive a gas car for a few years before i can afford a used roadster.. but i applaud you.. no anti-government, anti-big oil comments because we all know them already.. i cant put into words how happy the idea of this makes me.
PLEASE do not go public ( stock ). I am Obcessed with 100% EV technology. I am in the auto repair business, and own and operate a driveability facility. I hope you are being careful, EV’s have been tried and DESIRED before. GM has sucessfully eliminated EV’s twice in the same century. Chevron owns the battery patents for the battery pac used in the EV’s of recent past. Exide bought Edisons nickle iron battery company and all of it’s patents, and by 1975 and Edison nickle iron battery ( 60 year average life) cannot be bought in the western world ( US ). PLEASE keep your company going at any cost. There will be smear campaigns by those who have the power. Hopefully Tesla motors will be able to fight back. Just a note from an obcessed EV nut.
Having lived in London and NYC for the past ten years I have always used public transportation and do not own a car. In fact, I have not been to a gas station since I last rented a car over a year ago. Fortunately (or unfortunately depending on ones point of view) I am moving to the Bay Area and need a car. I would buy the two seater straight away however my wife and I recently had TWO kids so we need a “family” car. It would be great to know when the four seater will be available so we can anticipate how long we will have to endure gas stations in the mean time.
What is your company’s stock symbol?
—-
Editor’s Answer: Tesla Motors is privately held.
Hands Down:
I Hope this don’t become the next Tucker!
I am sick of Big Oil Big Auto and wasting time with Tec. that will never produce a car.
One Question! Think about it..
Fule Cell: waste is water?
Add Hydrgon and o2 and make water?
the hygron is from a Compressed Bottel… Where do they get the 02 from? Oh my last breath!
Ok so lets pour Carbon monxocide into to to atmephear for 100+ years then draw out the 02… After we cut down 60% of the tree’s… sounds like DEATH To Me.
100k is outside my range too, but if car #2 makes it to the $50s, the car almost pays for itself! I think you’ll find huge interest at that price point if Toyota doesn’t get serious competition ready by then.
I am the manager of the Site Design & Material Management Group of Site Engineering for Nokia/Siemens Networks. Our headquarters is in Irving, Texas. I am very much interested in the Tesla Roadster Battery Pack. We are trying to build next generation Cell Sites which are capable of providing service through all types of conditions, including terrror attacks, Force Majeure, and vandalism, etc. Can you tell me who builds the Tesla Roadster Battery Pack? We would like to know if they would help us by building a battery pack for cell sites. Thanks.
Regards,
Bob
—
Editor’s note: Tesla Energy Group develops the battery packs for the Tesla Roadster. Find out more here.
I was wondering if this master plan included any awd cars? it seems to me that the traction problem you guys face with the tesla roadster, and the instantaneous full torque you get out of an electric motor, would be solved and best served in a awd car. have you guys ever considered this?
Power plant emissions vary greatly, In the US, on average, generating a KWH of electricity produces 613 grams of CO2. In France, it’s only 83 grams, due to their extensive use of nuclear power. The point is, with an electric car, there is a choice of how the electricity is produced and how much CO2 is emitted. With a gasoline car, there is no choice but to pump the oil out of the ground and burn it away into the atmosphere. And the government will give you a tax break to buy a Hummer!
With regard to the master plan, the key is not just reducing cost through mass production, but even more importantly improving the battery technology. What is desperately needed are batteries with twice the longevity, twice the power capacity, at a quarter cost. Then the electric car can truly become mainstream, and hydrogen will disappear like the Zeppelins.
For a while now, I’ve decided I want to get off of the gasoline merry-go-round, and no matter how low gasoline or diesel prices may temporarily go, I’m never buying a petroleum fueled vehicle again. I want to put my vote in for a mid-size SUV with AWD. Once you can get the price range into the 50’s, you’ve got another customer here. And I would be comfortable with a 150 mile range. I’ll keep the gas powered car I have now for the long trips.
Bring It !!
I love what you are doing.
I cam back to the initial emission table from Elon Mask. I agree the comment from Matteo, that the values are C (carbon) content and C emissions in place of CO2. Add the wight of the 2 O (oxigen) atomes to get CO2, all values has to multiplied by 44/12.
This gives for the Roadster 46.2 g/km. This applies also for the other cars. The Toyota Prius will have then 131.3 g/km. The official value (2007) is 104 g/km. This 20% difference of the calculated value and the official is not clear to me, may be the new model is more efficiently or more breaking energy is stored back. Anyway, the Tesla is bether by factor two and also keep in mind, that Prius is a small car and the Roadster a sport car. It would be good when a corrected table will be published.
I predict it will be the start of a very lucrative move in car production; at this point the electric car concept has been a flop. This will change all that and pave the way to the future as far as cars are concerned.
I think the writing is on the wall for Oil Company’s people’s interest in cars like this will do more to bring oil prices down then anything else. They wont want too many company’s jumping on this technology.
Well that’s what I think.
An interesting analysis of energy efficiency and CO2 generation. However, what about the energy inputs and materials required to manufacture a vehicle and all its component parts? For all cars, you have to mine ore and other materials, make steel, fashion components, etc., all of which take both energy and raw materials, and include even the energy to recover those raw materials and fashion them into something useful. For your electric cars in particular, for example, you have to get the raw materials to make all those lithium-ion batteries, use energy and resources in their manufacture, etc. It’s not just the costs of running the vehicle, but also the total costs of bringing the vehicle into existance.
What you end up with is innumerable antecedents. Meaning, you have many, many inputs into the creation of the car, and even into the creation of the machines and devices that let you get the raw resources and do the manufacturing. It is really almost impossible to know the totality of what’s required, and to calculate it out scientifically as you attempt to do so here. Given the extreme complexity, only the economic system of market prices can really be used to answer the topic. The price of resources and parts embodies all the energy and material costs of bringing it into existance, down the entire production chain. Ergo, the price to create the finished product speaks volumes to the overall efficiency of energy and materials that go into the final product.
The overall cheaper car of comparative features should reflect what is overall more economically efficient, which is synonymous with what is more efficient in terms of overall use of materials and energy.
Fortunately, a big advantage of this fact is that the overall least costly option can easily generate widespread voluntary adoption by the public since it results in saving money.
You’ve got half of it down so far - the fact that it is so much cheaper to “fuel” the Tesla car does reflect the fact that powering the vehicle (including generating the electricity) is more efficient than using gasoline. Looking to the actual vehicle itself is the other half.
That said, I think your vehicles and technology are very cool, and I look forward to the day when I can purchase one both from an aesthetic and fiscally rational standpoint.
I hope someone from Tesla reads these comments. Not because they will learn something from what I’m going to write, but because they need to know that we, their future customers, know these facts as well as they do. As I’m writing this, oil is approaching $80 per barrel. At these levels, the market will eventually react and demand will increase for alternative energy sources. When this happens to a significant extent, I have no doubt that OPEC will manipulate the supply of oil to crash prices and therefore kill any other competing technologies. We know they’ve done this in the past.
My purpose for writing this, and what I want Tesla to realize we know, is that a lot of consumers are aware of these market manipulations by the oil industry. And even if our government doesn’t have the foresight to counter these manipulations, I can in my own small way. I will not be dissuaded by gasoline prices falling close to or under $2.00. I know that this will be a temporary drop meant to keep us hooked and prices will surely rise again.
What I’m saying is that even if gas prices should drop to a dollar, it won’t change my commitment to get off of the petroleum merry-go-round. I still will not purchase another petroleum powered vehicle. I want to encourage you to persevere in your plans. No matter what happens with fuel prices in the short run, you have a customer here waiting for that mid-size SUV under the $50,000 price level.
I am definitely interested in purchasing your second or third model. I already told my husband that even though I am due to replace my 2001 car, I refuse to give the other car dealers another penny. I am waiting for an electric vehicle. What are your safety/crash statistics? Do you have plans for a model that is a cross-over or an SUV? This would be nice since I need to take my children from point A to point B. Thanks.
Linda
In your estimation, will Tesla always remain private, or will you eventually go public, i.e., purchase stock, etc.
All I can say is that this had better not be some sort of prank. I mean, how feasible is this?!? This company that I (or anyone I’ve ever met) have never heard of brings out this new breakthrough technology that’s going to shred apart oil businesses, gasoline companies, and any car company that doesn’t keep up with the times. Once this technology becomes available to the masses, this is all that anyone’s going to buy. Gasoline stations will disappear. And I can’t believe how quiet this has been kept. This project has been four years in the making, and all I’ve ever seen of it is a little blurb in Newsweek?
All I can ask is, when are you guys going on the market?
—
Editor’s surprise: We’re definitely not being quiet. See our Media page for a sampling of articles about Tesla Motors.
Interesting business plan and I wish you success. If you never make a moderately priced vehicle, you will at least advance the technology and show that all electric is feasible. I think too, that many people around the world do not know the history of the automobile, but more importantly, the history of commercial transportation. Before the internal combustion engine made its debut, delivery trucks were predominantly electric as were many automobiles. The problem always came to batteries; i.e. energy storage.
For those of us that are more price conscious, an interim vehicle will most likely be something like the Nissan Mixim or the Peugoet Flextreme with very efficient IC engines operating only to charge on board batteries and drive the traction motors. Most do not realize that an IC engine could be built to operate over a very narrow rpm range and only enough HP to drive the generator and traction motor requirements. On board Li-Ion batteries could be used only for acceleration requirements or short-trip all electric operation. Typical IC engines have to produce much more HP than that needed for cruising at normal roadway speeds just to get the vehicle moving and get some momentuum. Whereas electric (and steam) produce maximum torque at stall conditions. That is what made diesel-electric locomotives so popular as well as the reduced maintenance costs versus steam power.
There are other places in the world that you might consider marketing your all electric vehicle other than the US or in addition to the US. Such places are Hong Kong, Macau, and Singapore. All three “cities” are beginning to tackle major pollution problems and all electric vehicles will end up with HUGE tax breaks. Most trips here are relatively short. Even a 200 mile range capacity would require charging about once a week, and as you are aware, all electricity here is 230-250V. In addition, there are many here that would find US$98,000 well within their price range.
All totally electric cars are doomed to national resistance until policiesare in place to apply road taxes to electric vehicles. Fuel taxes are a major source of financing for road infrastructure, so massive sales of electric vehicles will adversely impact road building and repair. We must move to a mileage tax or other equitable means of funding our highways before electric vehicles will meet with widespread support from politicos and government entities.
From one car enthusiast and engineer to another: I hope you beat the snot out of traditional car companies since we’ve known for 30 years they aren’t interested in saving the planet.
Now here’s food for thought: say all-electric vehicles catch on and in 30 years the vast majority of vehicles in the world are all-electric. That would mean the future of pollution in terms of transportation shifts to the aerospace industry (the one in which I work). Both Boeing and Airbus are pursuing alternative energies but both are similarly caught in the fossil fuel cycle and I personally don’t drink the Kool-Aid. What would the prospects of scaling up the power output and endurance of the EV cells to those which would make aerospace applications feasible and economically desirable to the end-customers (airlines)?
I like to invest in green companies and electric car production. When is Tesla stock going to be available to purchase on the market. If it is already available what are the call letters for the stock? If not any idea when it may go public? Thank you
With all the excitement of electric cars out there, has there been any thought of designing an electric motor for farm equipment..i.e. combines and tractors? These farm machines cost us a bundle in fuel…more of us are organic…but we can’t beat the fuel man…..there already is a company in Canada building better combines at 1/3 of the price of a new John D. Please keep us informed. We are green!!
“Where the rubber meets the road”
I am delighted that the roadster is coming along so well, but unless I win the lottery, I won’t be able to afford one.
What I really need is to have an idea when the other Tesla cars might be available? I will definitely be the first in line to get one. Are we talking years or decades here? Do I hold out with my 1995 Subaru (don’t laugh, it’s paid for) or break down and get the hybrid that is available now? I know you guys are focused on the imminent roadster and you really won’t know how much you’ll be able to put into other models until you’ve gotten a few on the road, but even an idea/ballpark/hint of a timeframe would be really helpful.
I was wondering when/if you company will ever trade publically?
You-tube is alive with videos on Stanley Meyer’s invention of a car running completely on water but one thing they mentioned in passing was that the water ICE would run better due to acceleration running a generator for a hybrid electric car. It seams that it is difficult to get the performance up on the water powered car. Stanley Meyer’s patent is now in the public domain but his dune buggy remains the only car that has run completely on water. This may be where all this technology is going.
How about a battery pack exchange process where the user has one battery pack on charge at the Solar House while driving the car with the charged pack?
How about a long range battery trailer towed behind the Electric Car complete with a Solar Panel charging roof?
What about a Green House cover over Solar panels with one way glass (mirror on the inside)?
How about using mass to generate electricity during braking?
What about this:
money.cnn.com/magazines/business2/business2_archive/2007/08/01/100138830/index.htm
How about a Sales Method where a Solar and Wind Farm charges exchange batteries, runs a Taxi service, leases, and sells Electric Cars?
I have to handed to Mr. Musk (Tesla Motors - CEO) as to how he is handling this company.
I don’t know how you are doing it, but it impreses me tremendously. Your fuel is defintely innovation, innovation and much more of the same …. I applaud your efforts, that of your enginners and the many talented people that make up the Tesla design team. Words alone cannot convey the joy that I received when I read about and visited your company’s website. It’s time that someone stood out and “Made it Happen”. It’s a shame that we are led by such a government “red Tape” and motor vehicle companys that are not and will not innovate. I thank you for at least trying to deploy a solution, or even attempting when failure may loom around the corner. The cornerstone of your success is your imagination, yet tenacious and brave compulsion to succeed at producing an auto that just about anyone will want and need to drive - God bless you all. You are an inspiration to us all and I will order from you in the future …..
Jose Alfonso
Miami, Florida
Here is a design for a Power House or Eco-Home
www.jetsongreen.com/2007/12/prototipo-di-ca.html
Construction costs are lowering as deflation sucks out currency. There will aways be a demand for POWER; at least until power is cost-less.
Why not build a low power cost home while powering up the home with renewable power? Why not network homes to pool power independently? Use it or lose it? How about use it to store more power by pumpling water, producing hydrogen from water, pressurizing both, and removing greater quantities of dependence?
Competition is banking on Oil industry weaning here:
www.autobloggreen.com/2007/12/10/breaking-gm-releases-first-teaser-shot-of-the-production-chevy/
“The Chevrolet Volt, GM’s electric plug-in vehicle, will be the first vehicle designed in the new studio. The Chevrolet Volt is a plug-in electric vehicle that will run up to 40 miles without ever using a drop of gasoline — which according to government data, would be enough to handle approximately two-thirds of daily commutes for American drivers. The first vehicle in GM’s “E-Flex” family, the Volt will be powered by an electric motor, which draws its energy from on-board batteries. The batteries, in turn, will be re-charged by a small internal combustion engine that will run on gas, diesel or ethanol. When not in use, the batteries will be re-charged by simply plugging the Volt into an electric outlet.”
Again - quck change battery pack systems can incorporate many new structures and opportunites for indivdual ‘volunteers’. A cart can be used to handle the wieght of the batteries - think Costco gas station/batter exchange station and, even, local entrepenuer ‘ in the neighborhood running a batter charging exchange from his Solar/Wind home. A return of the ’service’ station.
Why are brake/generator systems not being developed.
Example: A freight train or Truck/Trailer (A freight SHIP too) stores energy as inertia once it has reached a high point on any trip and during decents to lower altitudes (down hill) that inertia can cause the vehicle to overspeed which requires a force to declerate the mass. That force can be used to generate electriicty and recharge batteries. This is very simple stuff.
www.zenncars.com/specifications/specs_index.html
Above is a link to an electric car.
I always look for and have trouble finding the cost per mile or cost to charge.
A way to make that cost/benefit relationship user friendly would be a cost per mile/cost per month conversion applet.
Example:
Fill in the blanks and then press enter or ‘calculate’.
Variable ——————my current example
Cost per kWh ——————-.13 cents (electric bill from California Edison)
Cost per gallon gasoline ———-3.00
MPH of current vehicle————20 (Ford F150) or 30 (Honda Civic)
Miles per month average ———-700
Enter
—————————Ford———-Honda———-Electric
Cost per mile ———–.15————.10—————-.04
www.ecoworld.com/Home/articles2.cfm?TID=373
Wild guess
Enter (continued)
—————————-Ford————-Honda————-Electric
Cost per month——–$105.00———-$70.00—————$28
—————————-Ford————Honda————–Electric
Cost per year———$1,260.00——-$840.00————–$336.00
Cost per year for a fleet of 100 cars………………
Cost per life span of vehicle plus maintenance costs…………..
Cost per mile when home is generating Electricity with Solar Panels.
Cost change when gasoline goes up 1 dollar a gallon…..
Cost change when electricity goes up .10 cents per kWh….
Cost change when gasoline flow stops and electricity flow stops or is intermittent (embargo of gasoline, gas lines, black outs of electricity, peak usage of electricity over-charges, etc.)
www.solveclimate.com/blog/20071219/1-watt-itunes-solar-energy-has-arrived
“A Silicon Valley start-up called Nanosolar shipped its first solar panels — priced at $1 a watt. That’s the price at which solar energy gets cheaper than coal. Curious that this story is not on every front page. ”
My last effort to quantify the cost/benefit or installation cost/output relationship identified a $6 per watt ‘do it yourself’ installation cost (Solar Panel) and $9 per watt if the proffesionals do it (just call on the phone and eliminate the electric bill) which netted a rough figure profit if I pay .13 cents per kWh and a rough figure of LOSS if I pay .10 cents per kWh even if Uncle Schwarzeneger offers a 50 percent subsity of the total cost.
How, if the new cost is now $1 per watt, can anyone not afford to go Solar (and electric car)? Is this akin to selling food to starving people?
Genius. Pure genius. Not only is the concept amazing, I think the business plan has the real possibility to revolutionize the car industry. Not only is this a smart idea, but very smart execution (which is a multitude as important in a startup as the idea, which is something I am sure you are aware of). Congratulations on getting the financing round from sergey and larry. Good luck in execution, and looking forward to buying the roadster when I sell my first startup.
Cheers,
Soutrik
Bit of a mute point, but I’ve just realised the little contribution South African is making - in terms of increasing the number of options America has in reducing foreign oil dependence.
Between Elon Musk (originally from South Africa) and Sasol (the only commercial coal to oil (Fischer Tropsch) producer in the world, and a South African company) America has a war-free way to escape foreign oil dependence.
This would involve two simultaneous steps: 1.) Since America has more oil than the Middle East (the catch being that it is in indirect and difficult to access forms such as coal and shale) it would make sense for the US government to offer incentives to companies investing in synthetic oil production processes. Since Sasol has decades of commercial experience in this area it would make sense to involve them. This assumes the political will exists to overcome the vested interests of the existing oil companies. Since switching the motor industry (and its dependant industries) from the internal-combustion engine to electricity is likely to be a slow process, it makes sense to at least ensure that part of the oil supply comes from synthetic oils for the next decade or two; 2.) Gradually reduce the dependence on oil altogether by introducing electric vehicles.
Source of reserve claim: www.americanenergyindependence.com/nationalsecurity.html
Great! I hope I can buy the cars soon in Austria! Also your Joint Venture with the Norwegean EV Producer Th!nk , which will start selling a small city car soon in Europe, is a fantastic Idea and a good Investment. here is a link to the Electric Car Producer in Europe: blog.microsolar.at/?p=139 or www.think.no
I understand the strategy, and if it delivers electric motoring for the masses I’ll be very happy. However, I need and am prepared to order an electric mini capable of 150 miles range at 70 mph, every day, recharging overnight. I’ll settle for 2 seats and some luggage space. I’d love a Tesla, but I’ll never be able to afford one. How about it?
It really is about time that a company featuring Electric Vehicle products on this sort of scale has come along. I am serioulsy impressed with Telsa’s vision and their business strategy for promoting evs.
The pairing of solar panels and EVs is a match made in heaven; and with the eventually reduction in cost associated with photovoltaics, and more affordable vehicles offered from Telsa for the average customer, I am optimistic that we will see more and more EVs on the road in future.
I am really curious about what the future sedan model will look like, and how reliable it will be on really cold days.
I am one who believes the ICE should be completely out. The range extender trailer as a rental or purchasable option (doubles as stationary whole house UPS?) should be a small side thought. Unfortunately I will probably have to wait years before buying a new car, let alone a Tesla. I do drive an electric car almost every day but the lead batteries make it difficult. Have you considered selling managed battery packs to existing EV’rs to get us through until phase 3 is here?
Fascinating technology - interesting business plan too.
Whilst I understand the power struggle concept i don’t think it will reveal itself in the doomsday quasi-mafia format that is suggested by some. I think, based on my interepretation of the current US administration and its vested interests in the oil industry, that you should seek to expand your company by making your business international. Several European countries which are strongly of a green-ethic/mind in many ways, ’support’ your business. I imagine that if a company becomes internationally recognised and prolific and there is a significant amount of success generated by your company on a multinational level, the US adminsitration will be hard-pressed to use special operatives to ‘dissappear’ you and your company. Ultimately, if oil really is running out anytime soon, i can’t see how the US could maintain a grip on its power with regard to oil control. If there ain’t none, and someone else leads us into e new era relying on a different energy generation format, then I don’t see that there’s a fat lot they could, or would want to do to stop you. I’m looking at this very superficially I appreciate, but may main point, is simply to get known. NOT simply in America. Get your technology/business up and running in Germany, France, Holland, Belgium - you will be supported in your efforts. 90,000 dollars? That’s naff all for a car of the level of performance you’re offering, not to mention the exclusivity factor you’re offering, IF you market the product well (however one may do that, I won’t comment as I don’t know). Ferrari’s start at $210000/£102000 in the UK. I’d be curious to know how many of these sports cars you sell a year and where. London has some very well off people in - you could sell 50 a year no problem in London just as novelty toys to rich kids. That’s 4.5M dollars basic turnover…so surely worth trying to flog some in a few other prosperous economies without quite the samepolitical standpoint as the US?
OK, long-winded, and I’m sure you’ve considered all of this, but I am in the UK and I see so many people with Range Rovers BMW’s Audi’s and many SUV’s costing FROM £40000…GET THE PRODUCT OUT THERE. GOOD LUCK.
God bless you all at Tesla. Keep up the good work. I am looking forward to EV light weight private aircraft in the future.
thanks guy’s and gal’s. Carey Sorrell
I love that there are car designers that want extreme efficiency. I also can wait for a practical, commuter plug in electric car that will travel the 85 mile round trip to my work and back. Keep up the great work.
What can I say… I’ve been a big fan from the very first sneak peek. After I heard the initial numbers on range and efficiency I was inspired. I have a dream of being the first energy positive individual in my small southern town. After a few discussions with a client who is a Green builder, it seems that my dream can be a reality very soon. I think Tesla will help me get there with the release of your third generation sedan (side note: is it too indulgent to request a small crossover SUV for all the families out there???) Kudos to all of those at Tesla that had a dream and congratulations on achieving it!!!
I would like to challenge everyone to consider an investment in our future. Build green and invest in solar energy… With available plugin vehicles that will soon be affordable, almost everyone in America will have the ability to become energy positive. We can make a difference.
Thanks again Tesla… I look forward to the release of your 3rd generation vehicle!
Teslar is going to be a massive success with a business plan like that. If and when you go public on the stock market make sure you give me notice because I will be investing
.
I think the Electric Car will be a great thing for our world. I can imagine with companies like yourselves we will get some really efficient, sexy cars. With price drops like you are describing I’m guessing that the Roadster will also drop in price. Imagine selling that for under $50k that would really undercut any competition like porche in efficiency and price!
I hope the electric car industry is a bit like the computer industry where things are developed extremely quickly constantly out doing their last achievement etc. Unlike the current car industry who haven’t done any efficiency gains since 1970. My 2008 GM Holden Commodore (Australian car) uses 12Litres per 100km where my old 1981 commodore uses 14Litres per 100km. Its been 17 years with 2Litres efficiency gains, that just doesn’t make sense to me, I hate GM and oil give me electric!
One issue that seems overlooked in this race for an alternative transportation technologies is simply better energy management more than anything else, reduction of the cars weight - power to weight ratio, reduction of stupid metrics in media on 0-60 times and bigger HP motors with more cylinders - faster, sharper handling, offroading capability this is by far the worst feature sell after the HP wars and stop light racing.
Based on resident address and occupation disallow the use of miitary grade AWD vehicles claiming to be cars - Hummers all version, all tall wagons.
If as a species we shift the idea on its head and opt for something like this model it will all make a lot more sense.
Rules to keep in mind:
1. Reduce speeds to 50 Mph overall
2. This reduces saftey gear needed, air bags, abs, awd and all kinds of supplemental restraints
3. Use of more composite body panels and windshields.
3. Eat less reduce obesity - yes the car gets better range
4. Reduce entertainment, gear as well within no need for dvd, tv’s , microwave ovens in a car
5. Improve roads and traffic managment - more teleworking and staggered work days
None of the above are huge technological challenges compared to developing longer range batter packs and hybrid technologies.
My 2 cents
Elon, I saw a special on PBS last night which discussed the Tesla Roadster. There was a recurring point made about the energy infrastructure for hydrogen vehicles not being “there” yet. However, with your car, the US has the infrastructure - electricity! As an owner of an all electric car, I would want the ability to re-charge my vehicle at home at night. I would also want to get a quick re-charge on the road, much as I do now when I pull in to fill up my car with gasoline. Since the electrical power companies have the infrastructure, I was wondering if you had contacted them about opening “fueling stations”. I would think that they would want to increase their profits with minimal investment, i.e. “fueling stations”. According to the information on the PBS special, it takes app. 3-6 hours to fully re-charge the Tesla at home. Why not add a quick charge circuit (capacitors) to your vehicle so that an owner could drive into an electric fueling station and within a few minutes be fully re-charged? I’m saving up to buy a Tesla, and hope that the new models are out soon. Thanks for your investment, which will help us get off the use of middle eastern oil.
People do not need convincing, they need affordable electric vehicles now! High performance is great if you are a kid or a playboy but the rest of the world, those of us that work and support families and have responsibilities would love an electric vehicle now something more in the family style that does not cost $100,000.00 we need something that is reasonable. I think the time for convincing people of the value is well past and it’s time to move to mass production if your products can be mass produced the now is the time! Just my humble opinion.
So far your company, I think has the technology that could be implemented in other vehicles. Do you engage with other companies globally to develop other vehicles like an electric bus. I live in the Philippines and it needs a vehicle like yours. Public Utility Vehicles congest the streets here than privately owned ones. The jeepneys (an extended jeep) are the main mode of transport that carry up to 22 individuals an costs at around $10,000 but are also the main pollution contributor from the transport vehicles. Thank You
Looks like I have to quit complaining about the demise of American ingenuity! E-mail me when you go public, I will invest. Obviously innovation created your product. I sincerely hope the same innovation goes into the mass marketing process. Since the American consumer is less likely to quickly jump on to “new” technology, mass marketing will require the same innovation. There would seem to be a host of future related products, and a bunch of room for future add-on products. If you put in place a franchised dealer situation, and innovated a marriage between “Web 2.0″, car dealer, and “fuel station”, your concept could change the world. Please email me when your marketing plan evolves!
I sure hope that this really works. I believe that the US will either stop or make the car impossible. Our economy is government run {socialism} and all politicians are paid for by big business so it is going to be tough. I really dont care what the family model looks like , just sign me up. I saw the Leno site and I’m ready to buy this technology today. As an American CITIZEN I am aware that we are going to have to stand up and demand some of this electric technology. Most Americans are really COWARDS and talk big but dont show at events or rallies,so those of us that are willing to do so must work extra hard to help make this vision a reality ! I’m glad to see that those with means have a vision of purpose and a willingness of commitment for others not just themselves. My hat is off to these few who are willing to help make this a healthier and more affordable society . Thank you ,Mr. Elon Musk
First, I really wish the Roadster was priced more like a VW so that I could afford one and then work on becoming energy positive. The styling of the more affordable sedan is important, I recommend a look somewhere along the lines of an Audi S4, or even the affordable Mercedes C class.
Secondly, I know design and production of any new product takes quite some time and even longer if your looking for real quality, but if it would be possible to push up the release date for the Sedan even just a year to 2009 so that more people can benefit from Tesla’s Electric Car technology, I as well as my engineering friends would be very happy to join the team and buy the first ones off the line.
I guess a question about the Sedan I have is about charge. Since the car should be slightly larger will the range be similar per charge?
Thanks for taking the first steps to a better future.
Congrats on the of production of the Tesla! I hope to own a Tesla someday soon, In fact i have put off buying a new car for nearly 3 years trying to come up with the down payment so i could place my order.We may not all be able to come up with 110k for a roadster but I do have some ideas and they seem to work for other corporations,
1) Please consider going public with stock or bonds.Almost every blog that i have read on your site people are ready NOW and more than willing to invest in Tesla and EV technology.
2) Raffle off a Tesla once a month!
No I’m not kidding The National Corvette Museum does this and very successfully to add to their cash flow every month.
During times when cash is tight because of a special projects like the expansion to the museum they are currently experiencing they increase the number of Corvettes raffled per month.
This June there are 3.
1) The National Corvette Museum has begun a Corvette raffle fundraiser featuring a 2008 Black Corvette Coupe – limited to only 500 tickets available at $250 each . The winner will be drawn on Thursday, June 5 at 2:00 p.m. C.T . Winner need not be present to win.
2) The National Corvette Museum has opened an exciting opportunity to win a new 2008 Indy Pace Car Coupe replica with a limited production of only 500. Tickets are available at $100 each and only 2,008 tickets will be sold . The drawing will take place on June 11, 2008 at 2:00 PM . CT at the Museum
3) SOLD OUT!
The 427 Limited Edition Z06, number 2 of the 427 to be built for sale in the United States, features a Crystal Red tint coat exterior, the first Z06 ever offered with red metallic tint coat paint. It also features graphics on the hood and fascia that evoke the style of the famed “stinger” hood design and graphics that were offered with 1967 models equipped with the 427 engine. Also unique to this model are “427” hood badges. Each example is numbered and signed by Wil Cooksey, retiring Corvette Assembly Plant Manager and comes with a certificate of authenticity. Only 427 will be offered in the United States and Canada , with 78 more exported outside North America . This unique Corvette also includes exclusive new chrome wheels, body-color rear spoiler and door handles, exclusive dark titanium custom leather-wrapped interior, special Crystal Red interior trim plate graphic pattern and Wil Cooksey autographed console armrest. It also comes with 427 embroidered seats and floor mats, and Z06 sill plates. This raffle is limited to only 500 tickets available at $500 each. The winner will be drawn on Tuesday, June 24 at 2:00 p.m. CT.
I know that i would buy a ticket once a month at the very least for the chance to win a new Tesla Roadster …
I Know A lot Of People Would BECAUSE I ‘ve Read Your Blogs!
For the Record I haven’t missed a Corvette drawing in over 4 years!!
4) The winners of the raffles drive their new Tesla’s in their home towns which is good for marketing because there are people in their towns ,city and state that have heard of Tesla ’s but have never seen one in person and do have the money to purchase right away.
Remember A Picture Is Worth A Thousand Words!
Please help The Good Old USA by making EV’s less pricey and more attainable for Americans.We need electric vehicles NOW
Then maybe we won’t have to start another humiliating week watching our President beg our enemies for oil while they line their pockets with our hard earned money
Thanks for being so tenacious can’t wait to drive a Tesla!
Kathy Hilding
PS
I would be glad to volunteer to help at Tesla in any way that i can to expedite EV sales across America.
Most people in America have never seen the Tesla Roadster except for TV, Magazines or the Tesla website
People Across America need to see the Tesla Roadster in person.
Parked downtown at City Hall or at baseball stadium, at the Mall, at High Profile Airports an Train Stations across the Country, at County and State Fairs
Also it might be fun to have a design contest for the sedan and a future suv let the people who do the driving give Tesla some tips!
highly interested in purchasing a tesla car soon i hope . please let me know when a model under $40k comes on-line. I’m interested in setting up wind mill at my house as well hope you invest in wind technology as well. i want solar panels too. currently each of these tech’s is still not cost efficient . If you know of some that are let me know. my cell is 479-313-3202
In response to someone’s comment about the lithium batteries combustability, they do not in fact explode or combust. Rather, they vent, though quite rapidly. I recently saw something on PBS regarding the Tesla Motors design to prevent this being an issue. From what I recall, they have isolated the lithium batteries so that in the unlikely event that one should vent, it will not spread from one battery to another. Also, it should be noted, that lithium battery venting isn’t as common as the press it tends to receive, and when it does occur is typically from over or undercharging. Tesla motors no doubt uses protected lithium cells, which will largely prevent that from happening.
Now.. if only I could afford one of these. Its good to hear that Tesla has plans for vehicles beyond the pricey roadster. I am greatly anticipating the release of the 2nd model, and my pocketbook is ready for the payout, even on my meager income.
I feel that you have a great idea here. I’m glad someone has taken the courage to step outside of the box. Electric is the way to go. Power your home through solar power…sell the rest to the electric company. And of course have an electric car. This idea just needs to be implemented nationwide…then worldwide. You seem to be a very intellegent individual. I can remember first hearing about your company some time ago. I want to say around 2005, but I’m not sure to be honest. Just like you said, it all started off as a business plan. Well kudos to you. I hope you hold on to your intellectual rights and sell them off to the other automotive companies, as well as staying the leader of innovation within the automotive industry. Like you said…keep putting profits back into R & D…that’s where the future profits lie anyway. In my opinion you will hurt the oil industry, but they will still be around. Planes still have to travel overseas. And the possibility of an electrical problem in the air is just scary. I think you are doing a great thing here…helping out less fortunate American citizens. One day I believe you will reep the benefits from that, besides through money. Maybe you should push for possible government assistance. They need to implement your idea…and start switching service stations over nationwide from gas to electric plug-ins, in my personal opinion. I think maybe you should try and get a hold of other energy conservationists. Call me crazy but I would suggest try talking with: Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, Richard Branson, Al Gore, or Senator John McCain about what your plans are, and see if they can possibly help you. They all have great energy policies from what I understand. And if I am correct I believe I heard that it was hard for your company to first get initial support on implementing your ideas. I’m glad ya’ll have made it so far. On a different note I feel that our country needs to open more nuclear power plants…or possible large scale solar panel fields in order to substantiate such a large scale project. I believe the conservationists and environmentalists are the biggest problem we face in conquering this. Too many lobbyists are out there. Also do you believe that it would be possible to implement an all electric powered boat? Or would they have to stay gasoline powered? Anyways congradulations on your efforts, and I hope everything goes well with your future endeavors. Especially for our country’s sake.
Note: All of the above comments are based soley on my personal opinions and feelings.
i’ll take 2
There is something nice about being able to send a message to Elon Musk Chairman of the Board, Tesla.
First, congratulations for seeing the direction of technology, and going with it.
Next, good pick on the batteries. Using something tried and proven is always good for product confidence. I’m sure the next generation will be improved, but the first year needs only to be reliable.
The future of power generation in the world will fall on wind generation to a significant degree, because there is plenty of wind available, and because it is now price competitive with other power generation. Wind power makes your car even better as a clean drive technology. It wouldn’t hurt to feature some wind turbines as background if you do car adverts.
I see that you are involved with solar panel from SolarCity, a photovoltaics company (where you are the principal financier).
In roofing, there needs to be insulation, a backing support board, under felt, and shingles in a normal roof, then the Solar panel is stuck on top. There would be a huge improvement if the entire system were integrated, so the solar panel/water proofing/insulation/support components were a one piece section that attached directly to rafters and clipped together section by section. The result would be more attractive as a roofing system to new construction. Such a system would need to be made “open-source” so other companies could make attaching sections with water heating etc.
My biggest suggestion is about the PLUG. Please begin to encourage all businesses you interact with to install a public recharge plug and price it to make a profit. Make them open to all electric cars, Tesla’s, Zebra’s, and ones built by backyard mechanics. The sooner the most minimal infrastructure is in place, the more people will realize they can actually switch to an electric car.
Kudos to you for making a profit, and saving the world at the same time.
Sounds great except for the part about nuclear being a negligible carbon emitter. When the whole nuclear fuel cycle is considered, nuclear is about equal to natural gas in carbon emissions when all goes smoothly, and much worse than coal if things go terribly wrong. Additionally the tremendous cost of nuclear power takes money away from true solutions like renewables, conservation, and for that matter, things like the Tesla.
Wondering what it costs for a new battery bank, and where i can get the new 2008 economy model of your fine machine.
sir edmund
Please tell me that a truck is in the near future.
sincerely I love my truck
This is SO exciting! Great explanations about battery life, efficiency, and emmissions. I second Chuck McKibben’s comment. I want an off-road version! I hope I will soon be able to replace my aging Subaru Outback with a more efficient alternative and Tesla could be the answer.
I think this is a great idea– one I’d love to invest in. How can I though?
This is so awesome. Anyone who argues that this type of car is not feasible is probably in the oil business trying to perpetuate rumors so that people don’t buy these cars.
BUY THESE CARS !!!
SO THEY CAN MAKE MORE OF THEM !!!
SO WE CAN GET OFF OF OIL COMPLETELY !!!
I would buy one of these cars if it only went 60 miles per charge, and it took 10 hours to charge. I am not kidding or exaggerating. If I want to go on a road trip, I’ll rent a gas guzzler. Or even more likely I’ll just fly, because we need to make gas a thing of the past. And we need to do it fast.
I believe in what your doing and would love to invest in your company. How do we go about doing that, will you notify us when, if you go public?
and, oh yeah, the cars are HOT!
thanks
You’re a brave man in the “brave new world!” I’d love a new Tesla pick-up truck and pray that my old 1988 Ford F-250 holds up until you develop a replacement. I don’t want to buy another Detroit Gas Dinosaur in this lifetime. Are you planning on going public? I’d love to get in on the I.P.O.
Thanks for “thinking out of the box!” — Mike
Love the Roadster (and wish I could afford one!) and can’t wait for a sedan to come out. Hopefully I will be able to get on the waiting list for the sedan before you have a five year waiting period! With 10-20,000 cars annual production I’m sure this will happen very quickly. Are expansion plans being thought out once startup hickups are resolved?
Just a comment on JM’s post, flying is less efficient and uses more oil then having two people drive a car, especially in the older less fuel efficient planes.
Your teams product is S-o-o-ooo exciting and ultimately has a huge potential to become a page of history for all of mankind, and in a positive way. This is the kind of technology that comes out of this “silicone valley”, the internet, etc. I don’t know why maybe this area is like an invisible magnet for creativity and good will. I have lived here all of my life and I wouldn’t want to live anywhere else on this earth. My name is Leslie Cantu and I work in the Quality Department of one of your prospective sheetmetal sub-contractors and even if you don’t let us have the opportunity to make parts for you I am excited and overwelmed with all the messages these people have to say. It seems like people are finally ready to wake up and do what we American’s do so well and that is lead the way . Kudos to the Tesla team, Kudos; everybody’s hat’s off to you ! ! : )
I would like to know how many KW the tesla’s motor would require when running at 1500 rpm’s for use in a possible green application?
I would like to know whenever Telsa becomes available on the Stock Market, if you are what is the Ticket Number?
Thanks, great company!!
WHEN IS THE GOVERMENT GOING TO GET BEHID THIS TECH LIKE THEY DID PUTTING A MAN ON THE MOON. i THINK THE BIGGEST STEP FOR MAN KIND WOULD COME FROM ZERO EMMISIONS AND A STOP TO THE ADDICTION TO OIL . BUT MAYBE I AM CRAZY BUT WAS THIS NATION BUILT ON “FOR THE PEOPLE BY THE PEOPLE ” SO WHEN ARE THE PEOPLE GOING TO MAKE OUR GOVERMENT GO TO “THE MOON” (FOR THOSE AS DUMB AS THE GOVERMENT WANTS TO THINK i MEAN SUPPORT ELECTRIC CARS LIKE CA. EPA HAD THE CHANCE TO IN THE EIGHITIES.) BLOGING THIS GREAT COMPANY IS NOT HELPING BUT THIS COMPANY BLOGGING THE WHITE HOUSE WITH SIGNATURES FROM ITS BLOGLERS TO MAKE A SERIOUS CHAGNE WOULD BE A START. PLEASE LET US ALL TAKE A STEP FOR MAN KIND!!!
If I won the lottery…
The very first thing I would do is reserve one of your cars. It sucks to be poor!
Thank you for thinking and caring enough for the average American family those of us that go to work every day and provide for our families. A Tesla family car is just what is needed . I’ll be in line to get one, please do all you can to make this happen.
Excellent blog. Might I add — how about built in solar voltaic cells on the body of the vehicle (ie. roof, hood, etc.) to capture more energy while parked in the sun and/or while driving? Someone might commute to work in the morning, leave it parked out in the sun all day, then come back to a charged or partially charged vehicle to drive home. This will certainly extend the range.
… and LOL, Bob Soper.
Oh, Thanks! Really funny. Big ups!
What are the safety specs on the Roadster and the upcoming Model S. Are they as safe as or safer than Internal Combustion Engines than we have today.
If a Range Rover were to smash into the back of a Tesla Roadster at 50MPH what would happen.
Would the battery acid leak all over the passengers?
Would it be safer than an internal combustion engine because the vehicle is lighter?
Does Tesla Crash Test?
Does Tesla run Eco-Friendly Crash-Simulator Software?
What materials make up the body of the Tesla Roadster.
BTW don’t think I’m taking a shot at Tesla I love the car, I just want to know if its as safe or safer than my Audi A4 B7
-Grey
Have you guys at Tesla considered doing what Obama did for his campaign? For that matter Ron Paul pulled in a lot of cash too. Why not let the public buy preferred shares in your company over the Internet. Campaign for funds like they did. Hit me up every other day for money via credit card. Surely there must be a better way then to keep going back to the VC’s and have them take over everything once you have a successful product. Think about it, generate some enthusiasm for your product. Now that I think about it, GM is trying to do that right now without issuing any stock, they just want the money as we taxpayers get stuck for it. I would like to own some stock in a car company that builds a performance sports car!
NO CATALYTIC CONVERTER
I would like to see Tesla add “No catalytic converter” to its home page credits - 100% electric, 0 to 60 mph in 3.9 seconds, etc.
Some background is necessary here. I grew up in the S.F. Bay Area in the 1960s-70s and clearly remember the low/ground level pollution that pre-catalytic converter vehicles produced. I remember riding in the family station wagon(!) on freeways around the bay area and when pollution was bad and you could not see beyond a quarter mile, if that, because of gas and diesel vehicle produced ground-level pollution. While catalytic converters have since “burned off” that low-level pollution, it is at an equal if not higher price. I understand that gasoline combustion takes place at about 193 degrees. Exhaust gas heat from the engine warms up the catalytic converter and by design it raises to its operating temperature in the 600 to 700 hundred degree range. Even if you use the low end temperature of 600 degrees, while we have reduced low level atmospheric vehicle pollution we are also raising the temperature of the volume of the air used by a given vehicle from roughly 200 degrees pre-catalytic to 600+ degrees post-catalytic! Exhaust at 200 degrees is global atmospheric warming. Exhaust at 600+ degrees is global atmospheric burning.
I also think it would make for an excellent study - university or corporate (Stanford/Tesla?) - to estimate the total volume of atmosphere heated to 600 degrees by traffic produced in a given locale or worldwide by motor vehicles.
Please add “No catalytic converter” to your list of opening credits! I hope someday to be able to afford a Tesla!
Paul
Don’t know if you actually read this personaly but I wish you and your company the best of luck. Actually, I would like to know if there are any oppertunities for smaller individual investers in Tesla Motors. I have read your investment page and I have researched some of the companies involved, but I’d rather invest directly into a venture as opposed to giving my money to an investment firm. Some information on this would be much appreciated. Also, I read some notes above about the styling of the sedan. My advice would be to keep whoever did the styling for the roadster. They did a good job. I find that most of the N.American sedans are ugly as sin so dont bother with any preconcieved notions of what a sedan should look like according to them. Anyway about the investments, I noticed that in looking up your company, there’s a few people besides myself who wish to invest in it as well. I realize were going into a recession..potentially a depression, but I’m optimistic it wont go that far. The results of a flaud monetary system aside, this is something the people wan’t and will pay for. With the right media coverage no one (big oil, the governnment, CIA, the motor industry) would dare prevent this company from expanding. Long story short, there’s room for growth and therefore there’s plenty of interested investors.
Cheers,
I agree with Chris. You have a great concept and product. I will never be able to afford a Roadster but I would like to help in other ways. I am not a big investor but I would like to invest in Tesla Motors. I know a lot of people who also are not big investors but feel the same way. Is there a way we can buy Tesla Motors stock directly with out a broker? Think about how much money Pres. Obama generated because of his cultivation of “small investors.” Good luck!
I would like to know if the company will go public?
As a dealership department director for a “Big 3″ dealer I am very eagerly looking forward to the day where we can keep most if not all production back in the USA while leading the world in a less wreak less environmental future. I too must become a preferred stock holder the day Tesla goes public!
We have just successfully discoved how to use the power of Magnet to generate electricity. This is possible after more than 3 years of trying and testing different ways for them to work together. Some of the possible usage like making a computer fan runs 24 hrs without electricity or battery to more challenging job such as using the power of Magnet to run a car. We are still trying our all possibility. We are sure that this technology could be possible in space projects as well, however, we need the more experts to work together with us to make this possible.
Imagine, staying in a house or office where all the electric power required are generate by a self -installed magnet systems, and there is no need to pay for any electric bills.
We need Company to sponsor and support our invention and also bring this technology to worldwide applicattion and production.
Cheers to a world where no resources are wasted to generate electricity.
This is for Elon. I watched your David Letterman show last week . It was a great to see the progress you’ve made on the product development into the full sedan. However after you revealed the model 2 on the show you were about to make a statement about what was the most important item/advancement of the new car when David cut you off to talk to the “models”. Could you finish your thoughts on the car and the technology for the blog and email me the response as well. I think people need to hear where you are leading this technology. Thanks. MRW
Is your stock available to purchase at the nyse and what is the symbol
I WANT TO BUY STOCK!!!!! When do you plan to go public? This is the best plan I’ve ever seen.
I have been wanting to buy stock for over 7 months now since I first heard about the company? How does one go about investing in this company? I see that many are asking the same question that I am asking, I hope my overzealous attempts to “give” my money away does not come in vain. How do I invest in something that I believe in and hope changes the way we live our CO2 polluting lives.
Please keep me informed if, or when, your stock can be bought through the exchange?! Good luck and greatly appreciated!
I know I’m responding to a very old blog… but I just wanted to say this:
I was an early adopter of the smart car (www.smart.com) because it is practical and economical, but obviously it still uses oil. I said back when I purchased it in 2004 that I couldn’t wait for the day that people Will look at me driving my smart and be disgusted that I’m driving the most polluting car on the road. Thanks to companies like Tesla, that may be a reality some day. Thank you and good luck.
(obviously by that time I’ll no longer be driving my smart. Love that model s!!!!)
I am also interested in if or when stock will be available. Please let me know.
I was also wondering if Tesla Motors has given any thought about incorporating some of the technological
advancments that Soloman Technologies has developed and patented. www.solomontechnologies.com/
Their electric wheel is extremely fascinating and may prove to be very useful to the company and save
them millions in research and developement. They have aslo worked in conjuction with
NASA on some of their projects. just food for thought
Kip
U.S. ARMY (Ret)
I have read about the Tesla sportscar in the past and think that it certainly is a tribute to the late Serbian inventor genius, Nicola Tesla.
I do, however, have a chief concern in regard to the Tesla, and for that matter all electric vehicles, as well as hybridized automobiles in general.
These battery cells give off very powerful and dangerous EMF (electromagnetic fields) which can cause cancer. What type of insulation is being used in which to ensure that these fields are being contained?
When will this be on the stock market?
I have followed the TESLA Motors information from the beginning in 2006 I am very interested like many others about the ability to invest in Tesla as well as owning a Model S in the future.
Elon Musk… my intuition tells me your the best person for what your doing! I’d like to not only own your Tesla Roadster, but invest in the company. Love your style my friend!