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Always so much 60 vs. 85 talk what about 60 vs. Leaf!

A Leaf is from $32 to $40k in Ontario. A Tesla MS60 is $80k.

Comparison
Tesla gorgeous Leaf butt ugly.
Tesla 302hp Leaf 107hp
Range
Tesla 370km Leaf 120km
Seating
Tesla 5 Leaf 4 (sort of)
What about family safety?
Use really what can you do with 120k max range you just get going and you need a charge!

Now tell me all what we get going from a $40k Leaf for $40k more with a MS60?

I think it is a lot! Do I get more for the $40k additional than we get going up the Tesla scale?

I don't think there is any other EV on this planet that compares to Tesla, whether it's an 85 or 60.

Well I don't think there is any other car (EV, ICE, PHEV, ... whatever) on the planet that can offer what a Tesla does. That's why I ordered an S85.

You meant to ask if people who bought 60kWh regret that they did not buy the Leaf? I kind of doubt it. ;-)

@OP,

Great point. I feel the same way about the i3 and the Mercedes B class. Only the price difference shrinks to $20k difference. Having a long-range EV is killer. Short range stinks.

In the U.S. the Leaf has been offered on a $199/month lease. I'm actually considering getting one in a few years for my daughter when she begins driving. I'll still have to research safety ratings, etc, and I hope that the range is a bit better by then, as she travels about 25 miles each way to her gym and add a trip to school and it's close to expected range.

I would never consider getting her an MS60. Too nice of a car (and too much $) for a new driver!

You are getting triple the range and triple the horse power for only double the price!

Not to mention it is not butt ugly!

Leaves are for getting carpool lane access (in California, at least). Tesla is for that and so much more: range, driving pleasure, capacity, and the ability to look down upon anyone else with righteous condescension :-)

Just kidding about the last part.

Too bad Tesla canceled the 40 kWh model, then we would have an even better comparison with a Model S that costs only $50k!

If the S40 were back in the line up, the B class/i3/Volt wouldn't stand a chance in competing.

Of course the margin is too slim / negative for TM to resurrect the S40.

@ Mathew98,

Actually, how funny would it be for Elon to bring back the S40 and then issue a press release saying "Even our previously discontinued EVs are better than anything the competition is doing, so we are bringing them back!"

+1 AR :-)

@RedShift "Leaves are for getting carpool lane access "

Even more so are the plug-in Prius that got about only 10 miles BEV range. Majority of these Prius with green sticker you see in the HOV lanes are actually burning fossil fuel and emitting poisonous gases. Toyota has lost the remaining little respect I had for them for their original Prius effort.

My 60 far exceeds my range needs, I would get my wife a 40 in a heartbeat.

The MS60/85 is likely the safest car you can buy - by a significant margin. Just a few of the other pluses to consider over a Leaf:

- 17 Inch Infotainment screen!
- Huge cargo area, larger than many SUVs!
- Feels and looks luxurious!
- Continuous software upgrades with new features!
- Extending door handles!
- No scammy dealer involvement in purchase!

Of course you get the Tesla grin - priceless!

Some 40 Love! = Bigger Tesla grin!

Most people I know buy $30K cars, not $70K or $80K, so I do recommend Leafs if they're a two vehicle family anyway. At that price point, it actually does save a lot of money in long term operating cost.

My neighbor has a Volt he likes, for 30 miles, until the rough gas engine kicks in and the entire car shakes and makes bad noises which he and his wife hate. I am working on getting them to upgrade to the MS ;) Perfect for his 70 miles each way commute.

Watch this video and you'll not buy a Leaf.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qi03QawZEk

Leaf does not have battery temperature control and they lose range much, much faster than the Tesla.

Do we really have to do this? They are two different cars for two different segments of the EV marketplace. At more than twice the price, one would expect Model S to have better styling, performance, range and gee whiz electronics than a Leaf. Do we compare a Sentra to a Mercedes and then trash the Sentra for not measuring up? I own a Model S and a Leaf. Here's a few more comparisons:
1) The Leaf came with charge timers that will start and stop a session. It took Tesla about a year to get around to that, and all it does is start the session.
2) The Leaf has climate control timers that can be set in the car or by remote smartphone app.
3) The Leaf has a heated steering wheel.
4) The Leaf has heated rear seats controlled by the rear seat passengers.
5) The Leaf has a navigation system that will give you a choice of up to three navigation routes when available, route you around traffic, and avoid toll roads/bridges if you tell it to.
6) The Leaf navigation map displays all public access L2/L3 chargers, not just Superchargers and places we've charged before.
7) The Leaf has guidelines on the back-up camera display.
8) The Leaf has a CD/MP3 disc player in addition to an analog plug and USB digital audio input.
9) The Leaf's AM/FM/XM radio has twice as many station presets as a Model S.
10) The Leaf has direct connect Apple iDevice integration support.
11) The Leaf came with ergonomically useful cup and bottle holders.
12) I've never had to reboot my Leaf. It all works all the time. Yes, I have to take it to the dealer for software updates, but they verify everything is working before returning the car. With Tesla, it's plug and pray.
13) AFAIK, a Leaf battery has never caught fire!

@stevenmaifert. Wrong forum.

@stevenmaifert - I've no problem with the Leaf. Clearly better (in my mind) than an ICE car. Glad you can show some counterpoints too, but you're on target that it's really not an appropriate comparison - completely different segments.

The Leaf clearly benefits from Nissan's ability to drop in features from other car lines.

No, it's not the wrong forum. @stevenmaifert is right in pointing out that it depends on what you're focusing on. For the range, drivetrain, and driving dynamics, the Tesla blows it away, but for interior convenience and usefulness features, the Leaf seems to have a lot of things done better. No AUX input plug was surprising to me, too.

I cannot make fun of the Leaf. I'd take it over so many other cars, and I appreciate the effort that Nissan has put into it. Maybe they'll get better with it: They have a good example to follow. Maybe some day other companies will actually bother to build an electric car that everyone can buy that can have a real range capability without a gas engine. I'd like to see that.

The Leaf just doesn't quite cut it yet.

I have both and I actually prefer the Leaf for city driving. It's smaller size and more useful backup camera with guidance lines are a huge advantage in high density environments. It really IS a 5 passenger car, unlike the Volt. I love the heated stearing wheel! The lack of TMS is actually an advantage in saving energy on short trips. The battery decay rate seems to be as good as the Tesla in our cooler Canadian climate.
The Tesla has it beat on looks, performance and range, but the Leaf is very competitive. I'd definitely save the $10-15K and buy one over an i3 or a B-Class

I think this is good! What do we get for the $40k more on the Tesla is valid like going from a MS60 to P85+.

It is good to hear from owners of both that that Leaf does do some things better. I am not sure why I want to own a MS so much more.

I just lined up my neighbor with my NEMA 14-50 electrician for his Ford Focus Electric. He doesn't road trip often and drives sub 70 miles a day, so it looks like it will work for him as long as he can charge fully overnight with > 3mph range gained.

AR +1 on the S40
Folks, never say never. Nothing stopping TM from offering the S40 again. Nothing to lose and all to gain. If they get caught up on reservations, who know (except the boss himself), he might just bring it back to compete head-to-head to the MB B Class.

cr;
"in a few years" used 60s will be on the market, and maybe the ME -- so the comparisons will expand.

Steven
I do not mean to sound mean but not one of those 13 things save the battery catching on fire means a lot to me.
11 and 12 mean something but all put together 20 miles or just range would mean more to me.

I got on the list early and got one of the first few thousand Leafs. I leased it, thinking in 3 years they'd have something with more range. I've told people since I got my Leaf, I thought success for the BEV in LA would be the ability to drive to Las Vegas.

So, I'm happily driving my S85, and returning my Leaf this weekend. It has about a 50 mile range now.

Range anxiety gone. Replaced with grin.


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