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85kw, 60kw, and 40kw data on battery ranger

Here is what Model S true range and speed over time will do to the battery.

If you drive 20-30C you get half the range.

Is this your analysis? I suspect not. At the very least you should include the author's name!


The answer Tesla Engineer and -20 to -30C you get half the range in the winter.

Yes nick, we know you hate EVs, Tesla, and the Model S. You can go back under your bridge now.


I had GM EV1 before you were born. I love EV but because Tesla is a new car company there are problem with the car which Model S owner reporting so Im taking my time untill they resolve their problems.

@nnt - if you are taking your time so much, why are you here bothering those that do want the car now? Why don't you just go play on Mercedes forums until some arbitrary time in the future?

It's funny - while Model S owners do report problems here (many just happily drive their car), I haven't heard any saying they wish they could give the car back for what they paid for it. The only ones saying the car isn't worth buying are those that don't actually own it.

Ask how many MS owners will EVER buy an ICE again. Brief rentals under necessity and duress, only.

Brain H

Listen anybody who buys a EV will never go back to ICE. I know that. It can be the Leak. BMW I3, Ford Focus, iMEV, Tesla and the Smart Car EV. They are all good drives. I'm talking about extreme cold weather -20 to-30C in this post. Tesla doesn't want to talk about it.

My brother has a 85kw battery and who lives in Quebec city. If anybody doesn't know where is Quebec is. It's in Canada. In the winter he can't make the trip to Montreal which is 179 miles away. But he toldme when it get warm in the 60-70F he wouldn't have any problem reaching Montreal.

I just put a post about the real world Model S range and what cold weather does to range.

No I don't hate EV. I used to have a GM EV1 in the 90s before all of you got a a model S.

Or, nickniketown, your brother just can drive the car to get the range he needs. Heck I can get at least 175 miles in 30F temps with my 60kWh battery and using my normal driving style. Yes cold weather has an effect but take another 20% off that and I still get 140 miles.

Maybe it's the different battery chemistry. (is it different?)

I think nickniketown just can scrape together the money so he's coming up with excuses.


30F is very warm day in winter. We are talking about -30C not 30F and if you don't know it's -22F. Instead of jumping to conclusions and making remarks you should start reading the post carefully

Yes you do have a problem reading don't you nickniketown.

Yes, Sudre_, the two temps are very different. I lived all my life in Canada, and the coldest I ever experienced was -65°F. (The two scales are the same at -40°, btw.) Every car needs warming to start at that temperature. (The next day was -35°F with a stiff breeze. MUCH worse. Windchill really means something down there!)

nn, your brother will have to resort to the ultimate Tesla Range Extender, I'm afraid. He'll have to let his wife chauffeur him. ;(

-65 F is a nice hot 219 Kelvin.

Yabbut I prefer my Kelvins much closer to 300, please.

Don't know why you guys are ragging on Nick - the PDF he linked to seems pretty realistic based on my experience. I love my MS and think it helps to have real-world data (until they come up with a REAL trip planner integrated with the Nav and Energy systems). Seems that most folks feel you have to be all-FOR or all-AGAINST EVs/MS...I think it is OK to just tell it like it is. Great car, never want to drive ICE car again, but it takes planning (and sometimes patience) to do road trips for now. I came up with similar numbers - you can see mine at

@cliff - other than the fact it was made before the car was available and therefore had to be theoretical despite being promoted as based on real-world experience.

Thanks Cliff


Well, where did you get that PDF? Can you give me the link to Tesla website where it can be downloaded? While the numbers looks reasonable I still have doubts if it is not from Tesla source (I mean published by Tesla, not just compiled from some data by 3rd party) especially degradation after 9.5 years looks as pure guess (maybe precise, maybe not, we will know that for sure after 9 years, not much sooner).


Their is so many factors for battery degradation. Weather, how fast you drive, charging, how many times you use SC (the less the better )and if you are using standard or max range when charging. Ever case is different. Over time your battery can last 5 -15 years. It like how many times you change your oil in a ICE and how fast you drive..the harder you push your battery the fastest it going to degrade.

Have a nice day


It has not been said that Supercharging decreases battery life, your opinion isnt fact, so dont lump it in there please.


actually, it was said it is not decreasing battery life, however I really don't remember where I saw it so don't take me too seriously...

btw: in earning call Elon said there will be some more anouncements about Supercharging later this year... Can anybody guess what can we look forward? :-)

Yes I know, thats why Nikenick needs to not give out false info.

I think, at worst (according to the chart) if I get around 160-175miles of range after 9 or 10 years, I'm fine with that!

I do notice that really cold Northeast weather driving has a HUGE impact on range and battery "power."
I lost 30 miles of range after the car sat in NYC during dinner on a cold winter night (it was in the teens or low 20's I think). Kind of scared me a bit, since I had a 40 mile drive home. I got home with 15 or so miles of range so it was okay.


exactly... and thats why I don't take your numbers too seriously. Especially as your paper says nothing about miles driven per year and climate in which you are living.
Secondly, using main Tesla web page as source is ver bad idea becouse if somebody wants to check your claims he have to search through whole web and many many old blog posts to verify it... Source has to be precise and possibly to verify, othervise it is useless source.
And "Tesla battery engineer claims"... Really? How can we verify this source?

To be clear I never said your numbers are wrong, I just don't like how you are presenting them and I still don't know who is the author of this PDF and what kind of relationship he/she has to Tesla.


I'll ask again, since you seem to have missed it the first two times it was asked in this thread: can you tell us who the author of the PDF is?

A small amount of data (a single graph, it looks like) was taken from the Tesla web site and used to produce a six page document with all sorts of assumptions, interpolations, interpretations, etc. Heck, half the document is made up of notes which are mostly the author's opinions/guesses, and not based on empirical data at all. They may or may not be reasonable, but can't be independently verified unless we know the source/author of the document. (Again, I'm not talking about the source of the underlying data, i.e. Tesla itself; that's not the interesting part. What's interesting to the readers of this thread is the author of the PDF.)

Sorry if my last post seems disjointed, I wrote it before seeing the 4 replies above it.

Elon said more; there will be a "step change" in the speed SC supplies charge. I.e., charging times will drop drastically. That's what the NYT article was going to be about before Broder got the job.

I think that the current range of the 40K is zero. Completely uneffected by temps or charging.

I call Tesla and they told me they don't recommend using SC to offen. Once in a while like 2-3 times a month. Because it disgrade the battery over time. Talk to Jason about it from Tesla. More times you use it the fastest way the battery will disgrade over time.

@nnt - Which directly contradicts what Elon said at the unveiling of the Superchargers last year -- he said you could charge as often as you wanted because they adjusted the charge rate to prevent any damage to the battery.

But what do you care, you will be getting an SLS E-Drive with lithium titanate batteries because those are the best batteries in the world, right?

Jat talk to Jason from tesla. He'll give you the real inside scoop.

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