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Fremont Superchargers

Went to use the newly opened superchargers in Fremont, Ca today and much to my surprise the delivery team had taken all of the slots and were giving the delivery demonstrations on fully charged MS's. Would not have had an issue with it other than the fact that there was a line of about three long distance travelers waiting and after I had waited roughly 40 minutes and one customer drove away from the supercharger, I took the spot, delivery specialist started to say something but apparently thought better after seeing the line waiting. I know for a fact that as part of the final inspection cars are brought up to full charge via a supercharger in the final inspection area, and using the superchargers to maintain a full charge while delivering a vehicle is overkill.

Delivery demos while parked in the SC is bad form; especially with travelers waiting. If this is routine practice, it needs to stop.

Went to the Fremont SC tonight just after 10pm, thinking there would be no one there. Just ahead of me was a Blue MS and an already parked/charged Black MS. I was shocked that anyone would even be there. I was underwhelmed with position 2a. I had 100 miles of range on my 60. The best rates I was able to get were 100 miles per hour on 115A and 345V. During my stay another black MS came in to charge as well.

When I left at 11pm ish, the same black MS was still plugged in with no owner around, fully charged, and another Dark gray? MS was arriving.

I will have to try 1a or 1b next visit to see if it is any faster.
My wife suggested I bring my running shoes and do some laps around the massive parking lot while waiting for the SLOW charge! (In her words!)

like with the other SC's I think they will update/upgrade as they get some usage data. I suspect fremont will be quite busy as there are several thousand MS's in the penninsula and east bay.

Fortunately, they have hundreds of parking spots open at NUMI. There are rows for at least 20-30 more stalls along the bushes.

A couple of notes - Tesla tops up new cars over at the Service center with NEMA 240V power, not superchargers. They have a huge row of these chargers (maybe 30+). The final prep for all cars is done over there as well. They do have at least one Supercharger inside the factory, but it's used for confirmation that the charging system is working and not for charging. My guess is the battery pack is near fully charged when it is first assembled inside the factory.

I suspect the delivery specialist were demonstrating to new customers how Superchargers work, but perhaps a car didn't get fully charged. I agree, it would be nice if they didn't use them when others are waiting.

For those going to a Supercharger - to get the quickest charge pick a stall where the adjacent stall is empty that is labeled with the same number. At the top of the Supercharger is a number/letter like 1A, 1B, 2A, 2B, etc. If Stall 1A is in use, and 2A/2B are empty, pick 2A or 2B, but not 1B, as 1B may be quite a bit slower until the car in 1A is charged. Each pair is powered by a single set of electronics. With two cars, the power is split where the first car that connects of the pair gets priority for the fastest charge.

I'm amazed at the folks here who think Tesla doesn't have the right to use TESLA'S SuperChargers in any way they see fit!

The SuperChargers at Tesla's factory are obviously installed WITHIN a metropolitan area vs all the others that are installed BETWEEN metropolitan areas. The others are to facilitate long distance travel. The ones at the Tesla factory are obviously intended for a different purpose, and with SOOOO many Teslas in the area as well as passing through I think everyone should assume that they will be constantly very busy.

I have family in San Jose. I live in Southern California. When I'm visiting them I would like to be able to head over to the Fremont facility, stay an hour and gain 100 miles of range to drive around San Jose for the next couple of days. I sure don't want to head all the way to Gilroy to SuperCharge.

Sure I could find somebody with a NEMA 14-50 in their garage, or an L2 charger, but then I'd have to kill 3-4 hours to get that 100 miles and when I'm up there visiting time is valuable.

All I'm saying is that it would be nice to use the Fremont SuperChargers to charge when I'm up there visiting and it wouldn't be fun to be in a line of factory pick-ups and locals topping off.

I agree that Tesla should be able to do whatever it darn well pleases on their own property with their own SuperChargers.

TB: Yes, using the Fremont SuperChargers would be very convenient for the many thousands of Tesla owners and visitors in the area. Plan accordingly.

You bring up an interesting point. It might be fascinating to go down the line at the Fremont SuperCharger when full and ask each owner where they are visiting from.

I wonder if you'd find a lot of factory pickups, locals from the Bay Area, or people from out of town.

I guess it really doesn't matter. SuperChargers at no cost were always an advertised benefit of owning a Tesla and there's a whole thread on the etiquette of who should have dibs on the chargers.

I charged at 1B with everything else occupied. I drew 140 mph at the peak, beginning with around 85 miles of charge, so I don't know why some are reporting lower rates. Mine is a 60.

According to a Tesla person who I spoke with at the ribbon cutting event, this supercharger was mainly done for 'publicity' since it shows off these to others visiting the factory, as well as news generated by the opening ceremony itself. "They also help those who live nearby by not having to make trips to Gilroy for supercharging." (His words)

@joehuber my intent was to state the charging conditions so that long distance travelers can plan accordingly. I would not presume to tell TM how it can or can not utilize its resources, but resorting to feigned outrage is just juvenile. You must admit that the use of the scare resources in a wasteful manner is sad. In an emergency there are other charging options at TM Fremont such as HPWC on the other end of the building, they also have some 220 plugs near there. Lets not resort to name calling or discourteous dialog, this is a forum to discuss the tesla lifestyle. All opinions matter and are relavent.

TB: This is also a good example of why I feel the SuperChargers should NOT be free. I think it's a great for publicity, but free SuperCharging distorts the economic reality and isn't a scalable solution. SuperCharging will get ever more awkward and unpredictable as more and more Teslas hit the roads.

Fundamental economics should cause the price of something to vary so that Supply = Demand. This makes it economically worthwhile to offer a supply of a good or service that matches the demand.

Free SuperCharging is a completely artificial situation. Because it's free, the demand will completely outstrip the supply. What ECONOMIC incentive is there for Tesla to build enough SuperChargers to match demand? None. Certainly there are other incentives such as great publicity, customer satisfaction and good will, etc. But no direct economic drivers for them to build enough SuperChargering capacity to match demand for a free service.

Why should it be less expensive to charge at an SC than at home? This simply attracts the local crowd to stop off at an SC on the way home from work.

Would not a long distance MS traveler welcome paying for a fast charge if it meant there would be a charging station available and he wouldn't have to wait?

Wouldn't MS drivers be more inclined to move their cars more quickly when finished charging IF there was a per minute fee for parking in the charging stall?

Asking SC users to have good etiquette is a weak approach to sharing the limited SC resources. Especially when there are straight forward economic incentives we're all familiar with.

Pay for what you use, kWh consumed and minutes parked in a charging stall. Very similar to cell phone data usage and minute charges.

Locals would no longer be incentivized to use SC resources. And I'll bet the etiquette of long distance MS drivers would improve too.

Free SuperCharging is not the blessing it may first appear to be, if it's not conveniently available when you need it.

Joe:

I would disagree that there is no economic incentive for SuperChargers. In the near term, they remove a barrier to entry for EV buyers. Almost everyone asks me if I can drive to LA in my MS and they are surprised when I say yes. I would argue the number one challenge to EV adoption is range anxiety (real or not) and the SC network puts that to bed. This translates to more Tesla sales.

Second, the SC network becomes a competitive advantage for Tesla in the long run which can drive additional revenue and help them maintain pricing power.

O

Occupying SC spaces when not charging, especially when other are waiting, is wrong even if it is Tesla doing it. Tesla cannot have it both ways: either these are public SC and available to all or they should have a non-public SC for demos etc. If public, they have a duty to their customers to not waste such a valuable resource. For those traveling, having to wait hours with screaming kids etc while someone occupies a SC space while not charging is an experience that I would not wish on my worst enemy.

Tesla SC are always going to remain free, at least while Elon is in charge. Elon has stated this time and time again.

However, this does not mean there should not be for profit SC. As I have said on other threads, Tesla should license out the technology to a 3rd party who could develop a for profit SC network in cities and other destinations. I certainly would be more than happy to pay for quick SC availability while traveling.

I don't know what's the plan in Fremont, but in Hawthorne, as pictured, only the far left (with the display lit up inside) out of the 4 cars in 4 active bays was a private car. The other 3 were Tesla's demos or for deliveries.

Public drivers just need to tell the reception to move their cars and they would gladly vacate the bays for you.

If you think Gilroy was crowded - just watch this puppy. And at the risk of bringing on the ire - my guess is it will be drowned with local/staying-local cars, as opposed to those getting a charge on a trek through the bay area. As joehuber noted - will be 'convenient' to many 1000's of cars. Let the good times begin...

At least the locals can't get lost in the shops or movie theater.

I think is about being courteous, being ICED is one thing, (signage should be in place to prevent this from occurring) but being BEV BLOCKED is another, especially by another Tesla Model S!

As with any supercharger, once the car is done charging, courteously move it from the supercharger spot to make the supercharging spot available for another.

Courteously leave a phone number on the dash and approximate time the car will have enough energy in it for you to vacate the spot and be on your way.

There is everything right with being courteous to one another!!

If the locals are smarter than rutabagas, they won't bother trying to drive to Fremont and wait behind each other in line to save $3. Much less than minimum wage for the time it requires. Home charging is far more convenient for local driving.

Right - and Gilroy is packed because of this infallible logic. Try again.

Gilroy is packed because there are 4000 cars north of it and Gilroy is the only option for the weekend travel south.
North you have no charging options, so deciding where to go on a weekend escaping the heat is only Monterey / Carmel. Coming from the North Bay or Sacramento you need Gilroy. If there would be a SC north of SF then the weekend traffic would split due to options.

Look at it from another perspective
ICE cars per gas station : 200M divided by 120k ~ 1500 cars per gas station
MS per SC : 15k divided by 18 ~ 800 MS per SC
Gilroy : 4k divided by 1 = 4k MS per SC
Fremont cuts it down to 2k, Salinas to 1.3k,... but you need more options to get to a healthy level.

To support Brians point... we are going to my wifes parents about twice a months and passing by Fremont. The trip costs us $8 (vs $40 in an ICE). RT is 200 miles and so no need to stop. Would I consider to stop for half an hour to recover $4-$6 ? No - not in a million years.

OK, tried again tonight. Was the only MS there 9ish, and the charging rate went up to 163 miles/hour. Very happy.

Regarding charging... I don't care who is charging, just please do not leave car plugged in for extending periods of time and just leave.

Tesla, thanks for the SC! I don't need it (ie. saving 3$ doesn't make my day) but I will use it unless there is someone waiting for it.

I used it this morning and at peak I received around 236 mph. I was only MS there, I only used it due to my long range commute and nowhere to charge during the week. I never leave the vehicle when charging so if others need it I can be courteous and move.

+1 Brian.

It costs so less to charge at home late at night, that I have decided not to charge there unless in some emergency. Also, I want to be smarter than a rutabaga.

It might not be so bad, because my guess is that the majority of the owners are on the pennisula side, and won't make the trip to the East Bay to charge. Maybe some of the Tesla employees will use the chargers. Do Tesla employees get a discount on the cars?

I have never charged on a supercharger before, though i can with my 85. I am not sure if the supercharger in fremont was intended to be used the same way as Gilroy's. My guess is this is mostly for delivery and maybe just to say there is one there.

I agree that all superchargers should not be used as a parking lot, by Tesla nor by owners. Etiquette is just making sure you are charging while parked. We should not be expecting anything from anyone in terms of going ahead because you are a long distance traveler or a local that needs a quick top-up. Expectations spawn ire and not everyone share the same expectations. If only we adhere to this rule then it doesn't matter where you come from, its just a matter of one owner waiting for a charge. If you really need a charge, then ask nicely and wait for good graces, rather than rant about your time.

Everyone paid to have access to this resource and everyone has the right to use them, local or not local. If someone enjoys waiting in line, let them be. I think those people just want to see fellow owners and kill time, which is perfectly fine.

I kinda am tired for one of seeing people complain about the superchargers. I haven't used one, but at this point am not looking forward to if the guy before me is unhappy about waiting. So hopefully we can change the thinking for people and just be courteous but non assuming.

+1 on @LuvTesla.

Everybody paid for this resource and should have access to it.

The access needs to be fair and that's it in my opinion.

Unfortunately, if you are going between San Francisco and LA (which the Hyperloop document states is the busiest California corridor), even with the Fremont location, you STILL need to go through Gilroy. No other major route to get to I-5 South.

actually Fremont - Harris 580/I5 is the better route - only 4 miles longer then 152/I5 and probably faster.


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