Forums

Join The Community
RegisterLogin

Supercharger Access cost for 60kWh battery and other Options & Specs questions

Trying to get a very accurate comparison of the 60kWh, 85kWh & 85kWh Performance options as it is getting close to making an order and signing a contract. The Options & Specs page though very informative has left me with many questions. Questions that without the answers I will not be able to order my Model S.

Can TESLA come up with the cost for Supercharger Access for the 60kWh battery now and go ahead and post this cost to the Options & Specs page. TBD could almost be anything and way too much of a variable to just not care what the final cost will be? If the cost for Supercharger Access is cost prohibitive, why put out the extra cost for the Twin chargers and High Power Wall Connector?

What is the difference between the regular drive inverter and the high performance drive inverter included in the Performance Model S? Are the High Performance Tires and 21" wheels just for looks without the high performance drive inverter? If Supercharger Access is included with the Performance model shouldn't the Twin chargers come standard on the Performance model? I've compared the 85kWh battery model with the 85kWh battery Performance model and can easily come up with $6,500 worth of upgrades but am having a hard time justifying the additional $8,500 cost between the two models. Is there really $8,500 cost tied to the high performance drive inverter?

Also, is there a destination charge for making delivery to my home? Is this charge a flat fee charged to everyone, or is it based on the actual milage to deliver from the factory to my home?

A quick response by TESLA on these questions would be appreciated.

US P #8046

DanD - Amen!

I second DanD.

stephen;
Cross-country with a Model S:
1) Hire a flatbed.
2) ...

/8-)

Way to suck the joy out of an awesome journey, Brian!

;D

Alternative:
Pack air mattress and blankets in back/frunk;
Plot all national, state, and RV parks along route.
Drive to closest to full range each day, park and sleep and charge a few hours, then hit the road.

This will maximize time on the road, at the cost of destroying your circadian rhythms. ;p

Green Car Reports: "Does Public Charging Network Confusion Hurt Electric-Car Use?"
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1075451_does-public-charging-network...

I just received an email from Telsa stating that the personal delivery charge would be $990 and $180 for a final inspection / paperwork fee. Unclear if delivery charge could be waived if you picked it up at factory. Don't forget to add sales tax and the $1200 home charger that most buyers will need. Although our prepaid deposit will be deducted from the final price which is nice, the federal credit if you qualify, you will not realize the savings until your taxes are filed. But enough of that, just think how you will feel when your Model S arrives at your home.

- Unclear if delivery charge could be waived if you picked it up at factory.

It's been made clear in posts on the other forum: There will be no difference in the delivery charge between factory, store, or home delivery. They have also said that they want to push home delivery as much as possible because they want to ensure proper network set up and charging.

I don't think most buyers are going to need the $1200 home charger and the extra $1500 on-board charger (twin charger option) to use the home charger effectively. You would only need it if your daily driving requirement takes the battery to near exhaustion every day and you need the quicker overnight recharge. I plan on having an electrician install a 240V NEMA 14-50 outlet in my garage and use the included adapter that will come with the Model S.

Steven:
Good point. Home charger using on-board charger (twin charger option) charges 62 miles/hr or 31 miles/hr with the single charger. Using a 240V as you plan, will your setup charge at 31mi/hr? If so, even if 300mi 85kWh empty battery could charge in 10hrs. If so could save $1200+$1500=$2700 by not needing these as you said, I will have to rethink my needs! But can you still get the twin charger installed in future if your needs change?

Jerry:
I planned on home delivery anyway. Seems like the best way to go. Telsa will likely place it inside their enclosed trailer.

My permanent home is in Washington state and will not have to pay sales tax on this all electric car. But I spend winters in Arizona. If I be take delivery in AZ can i license it in WA and pay no sales tax? Or will I have to pay AZ sales tax?

I believe there is no sales tax on electric cars in AZ either so it won't matter.

"I plan on having an electrician install a 240V NEMA 14-50 outlet in my garage and use the included adapter that will come with the Model S."

Personally I do not want to pack and unpack the UMC all the time. I want a permanent charge point on my wall. A good looking one, not a cable with a box on, connected to a socket. Something that can be mounted outside, as we park in our front yard.

However, the HPC won't work since we can't spare (and don't need) more than 25A of charging power. The HPC can't be dialed that far down. Hopefully some other solution will be made available, I would prefer not to use a J1772 unit with the J1772 adapter all the time.

"Mr. Musk said that the first Supercharger would be installed along Interstate 5 at the Harris Ranch in Coalinga, Calif., roughly halfway between Los Angeles and San Francisco, within the next three or four months."

This article was dated October 26, 2011. Has anyone seen or heard anything about the status?

http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/10/26/bucking-trends-tesla-goes-it-...

- However, the HPC won't work since we can't spare (and don't need) more than 25A of charging power. The HPC can't be dialed that far down. Hopefully some other solution will be made available, I would prefer not to use a J1772 unit with the J1772 adapter all the time.

1. The most efficient charging is over 32A. Below 32A actual power usage goes up.
http://www.saxton.org/tom_saxton/2010/07/tesla-roadster-charging-rates.html

2. http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/6171-DIY-Home-EVSE/page15
On the bottom of that page is a post by hcsharp.

Each of our charging needs will vary with our driving needs. I plan on getting the 85kWh battery with most of my charging being done at home. The 240V NEMA 14-50 outlet works just fine for me and I will coil the UMC cable on a rack. For GeorgeA - TM says the 10 kW capable single on-board charger can handle up to 40 Amps which is the nominal draw of a 240V NEMA 14-50 50 Amp circuit. Your thoughts about charging at a 31mi/hr 10 hour recharge would be pretty close I would think for a depleted 85kWh battery.

@MyDreamCar - Tesla had a Level 2 HPC for the Roadster up and running at Harris Ranch in January 2011: http://carstations.com/3814 I don't know one way or the other, but it's probably a safe bet they are upgrading that location to the first DC Supercharger. If it was operational, I'm sure it would have been announced with the usual Tesla fanfare. So far, nothing I can find. If anyone reading this has passed by that location recently, your observation would be appreciated.

I was thinking something like this with a Tesla connector mounted on the ceiling of the garage.

http://www.khindustries.com/webmodules/catcatalog/dtl_category.aspx?CatID=8

@MandL, that is cool and I think we can adapt it to the Model S' charger?

"The most efficient charging is over 32A. Below 32A actual power usage goes up."

Doesn't matter here as I will probably blow the main fuse if I try to charge at 32A or more. The sweet spot for us is probably 20A. I actually have a 20A EVSE for my Leaf now (Clipper Creek LCS-25), if they start to make them with optional Tesla connectors that would be nice :)

@jkirkebo - You touched on a good point. For those contemplating installing the TM HPC, they should check on the rating of the electrical service to their home. If the rating on the main breaker in the power panel is 100 Amps or less, it would be a good idea to have the service evaluated by an electrician before making the HPC purchase. Chances are you will have to upgrade and that can get expensive, especially if the service line is buried like mine was when I had to upgrade to 200 Amp service to accommodate a solar power installation.

@MandL - I like your idea of the retractable cord set. Problem is cost. I contacted the company you referenced and they wanted over 3 grand for the high voltage and high current version. If you wanted to only have the 120V version at low current for everyday operation, then the cost is much more reasonable. Of course the other issue would be the availability of Tesla's connector to make this a truely plug and play option.

Whatever you do, you want to make sure your cables are set so you don't have it coiled anywhere when charging. The coil can waste energy as well as overheat.

Unfortunately I already have the maximum normal service, 3x63A. I know Model S will support 3-phase in Europe but I assume it will only support the normal 400V 3-phase and not the 230V delta-only variant used in Norway and Albania only. Thus I expect to be limited to single-phase charging and since I already have two 3-phase appliances (heat pump (max 3x32A) and induction cooktop (max 3x20A) it's quite limited how much power I can pull from any single phase.

So in conclusion I'd like to see a "mini" HPC too, supporting 16 to 40A draw and thus with thinner wires.

@DanD
this isn't a joke and we're not particuarly happy to hear "that's what you should expect as an early adopter".

While I agree that Tesla should not be saying or implying anything like this, it's still going to be true to some extent. Spending $10,000 on the latest TV isn't a joke either, but still rich people do it, knowing full well that in 2 years or less, the same tech will be better implemented with beter features at bigger sizes for < $2000.

I'm not suggesting that Tesla is taking shortcuts or disregarding customers. I don't think that at all. But I'm almost certain that, should Tesla succeed with the Model S, that the cars 5-10 years down the road are going to be much better. If that's not the case, then what is Tesla doing really? What's there to look forward to?

In the future, the batteries are going to take your car much farther for less money. I also bet that in the future, there will be a sedan (and I'm not saying it's Bluestar) that is more mass market priced and it will have better features and more features than the Model S. There will also be more models, and more options more variations for each of those models to better suit different needs and tastes then what we have now.

You're buying a new type of car that also comes from a new company that is building a car from the ground up for the first time. (Roadster was developed and produced with Lotus). So aside from the given aspects of being an early adopter with technology, there's also several factors that differ from buying a car, even if it was a new type of car (Volt, Leaf, etc), from a giant car company with a global network or people, facilities, and resources.

So yes, we're early adopters, and there's almost certainly some aspects of this product and purchase experience that are affected by that factor.


X Deutschland Site Besuchen