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WARNING!!! EXTREME WEAR ON REAR TIRES!

I subscribe to the FB Tesla MS owners site and one post referred to extreme wear on the inside of his rear tires after only 8100 miles, the wear was so severe the cord was exposed. Being curious, I checked my rear tires and after ONLY 1600 miles I had the same extreme wear! I can see and feel the cord exposed. Everyone should check their rear tires IMMEDIATELY!

Doesn't Tesla service includes unlimited free alignments and rotations? If so, I'll be taking mine in every 3000-5000 miles for a professional inspection.

RedShift,
I added just a touch of material everywhere on the link to stay on the safe side of Tesla's design. That being said, I think Tesla WAY over designed MS. If I were to guess, I would say the engineering team knew they had one bite at the apple and could not afford any issues. They responded by increasing the margin of safety in just about every part of the suspension. It is kinda nice for us MS owners :)

With respect to warranty, Tesla is obviously not responsible for my links. Apart from the link, everything else is Tesla down to the bushings that I pressed out of the Tesla links and into mine. In my situation, I balanced $1040 a set rear tires against the cost of the arms and the fact that the arms would not be in warranty. The arms won.

It is very strange that people's experiences are so varied. My (educated from other cars) guess is that the -1.9 degrees of camber on the rear of my car would wear out the complete set in about 8K miles and that includes moving them from left to right to use both shoulders. That whole process is a PITA and I can not imagine Tesla would install the tires with the "this side out" marking on the inside. Given this, Tesla's service would be of little to no use for this task.

lolachampcar...many thanks for all of your efforts on our (and your) behalf. If I can summarize, for us 'average' MS drivers without extra driver training (to overcome natural urges in cornering), I assume the current factory design/setup allows for good handling and safety at the expense of potential greater tire wear, especially on 21" vs 19". If I do not drive like a maniac, watch my tire presures, and rotate every 5000 mi, I assume that I will get 'appropriate' tire wear. You have personally taken the route of improved tire wear as an expert driver with the training and expertise to manage the car far more skillfully than I.

JPPTM,
Everyone makes their own call but I really can not feel any significant difference in my car's handling. MS owners in S. Florida are welcome to drive it and judge for themselves.

I did the same thing on my Maranello (it had adjustable rear camber) and, likewise, could not tell any real difference in handling. Maybe you could tell the difference when pushed hard on a racetrack but I can not imagine I'll ever do that with my daily driver (MS).

Lola, Seems you went through all the trouble to make the modifications because you assumed the car is designed this way and it's not a QC problem. Why is it that many people don't see the same wear as you did? Maybe you should let Tesla engineers to take a look at this first even though it appears you are very knowledgeable in this area. After all they designed the car. It's better for them to resolve any issues instead of second guessing it. That will also better serve other MS owners instead creating an uncertainty. Just my humble opinion.

The roadster goes throuh rear tires every 6-8k miles I've had mine for 3 years and have replaced rear tires every year, and yes, I like to drive fast :-)

I started by asking Tesla for the alignment specs and my car was within those specs (thus my conclusion that, like BMW, MB, Audi and others, Tesla did it on purpose). In addition, the upper and lower links are a fixed length and thus I concluded it was not a QC problem and thus not Tesla's problem. Had I asked Tesla's engineers they would rightly have said we designed it that way.

I did not start this thread; mferrazano did. I too am perplexed as to why some people are having problems while others are not. My actions were not based on others having problems but from my own experience with other cars. I knew the second I saw the rear tires that I would have to do something. Once I saw there was no adjustment, I knew I had to make links. I've always been a little outside the box on these types of things and am in no way suggesting everyone needs to go out and replace their arms.

My guess is that the amount of toe the car has (within Tesla's spec) is being amplified by the camber. This literally is my guess and I have no data to back it up at all. Given that toe is the only thing that is adjustable in the rear it just shouts out to me as a potential player in the wear equation.

RonaldA,
Is that not what the Roadster is for???? :)

Lola, Op did go to Tesla service and found out that alignment is way out of spec. That seems to be a QC problem to me. Aside from that I have not read anyone here say he/she had the problem and/or went to Tesla to get their opinions of what has happened. I don't think it's productive to second guess without words from horse's mouth and create uncertainties in MS owner's mind. Again I'm not an expert in this area what I am suggesting is just a logical thing to do. Tire wear like you described under normal driving condition is not acceptable even for a high performance tire, not to mention the ones on MS is not exactly that high performance. I'm sure Tesla will address it if you just discuss the situation with them.

Ok, for anyone reading, I am not suggesting there is a problem with MS.

As for you, carlk, back (and piss) off.

Bill

Hey no need to get mad. All I'm saying is there is no evidence, and not very reasonable to believe, Tesla designed the car to have extremely high tire wear for a normal driver. Besides it is Tesla's responsibility to tackle the problem even if it is. No?

It's not mad, it is just past experience with forums. People do not act the same on forums as they do in person so I tend to push back quickly on forums.

I did not start this thread and I have gone out of my way to say it is not a design flaw with MS. A lot of manufacturers do the exact same thing and have accelerated wear as well. If you have an issue with the alarmist nature of this thread then I suggest you take it up with the originator and not me.

I have also questioned the wide disparity in reports of wear. It was a personal choice to make a change and I shared that information for those interested in the path I took. It is but one of many options when thinking about the issue (if there is an issue at all) and exactly the type and nature of information I hope to find throughly discussed in forums.

lola;
quite helpful for those who don't want to venture into the bushings unarmed. :)

This is a great forum on the tire alignment issues at hand. I got 9000k on the back tires for a 19" P85 and for 400 rated tires, this is not right. Alignment appears to be the issue.

R

Found out from America's Tire that they have seen quite a few Rear Passenger tires wearing out more than usual. This may be a known problem. 19" Model S.

Okay confirmed w/ a few other owners that this is a known problem for early owners pre 5000. Maybe they'll take care of us.

I am Sig 736, nearing 10k miles, and not noticing that much excessive wear on my rear tires.

I wonder if it has something to do with the type of roads, driving style, and or adjustments Tesla made to the toe on MS's after my vin?

It probably makes sense for those of us with early production cars to ask service to check the tires and alignment whenever we bring it in for a repair, upgrade, regular service, etc. And of course to check the tires ourselves, and bring the car in if the wear looks excessive.

DouglasR

good point. I think those before 5000 should probably take a look at their tires and see if they are getting uneven wear as well.

Maybe this will get standardized in their service knowledge base (if they have one)

Just to add another point to the graph: I have VIN 62XX, picked up on March 6. I now have 4,000 miles, and I can see no discernible wear on any of the tires.

Oh, sorry, mine is a P85, 19" tires.

I was the original poster. TM replaced the two rear tires free of charge, re-aligned the car, and with 4000+ miles on them so far so good, the tires look fine. It was the alignment being so far out of spec that ruined the first set of rear tires.

mferrazano

thanks. I'll reach out to them and figure out what's going on.

R

We have a Model S. I did not notice that our 21" tires were wearing on the far inside. At 9596 miles I got a warning indicator of low air pressure so I stopped to check the tires. I found the wear was so bad it had wore all the way through the tire and the air escaped. Got the car towed home. Called Tesla Service center and they said this is normal. Paying $0.15/mile for just tires seems crazy! I am thinking about replacing the 21" performace wheels with the standard 19" wheels or some other wheel . . . any suggestions?

@John38 - friends with sticky performance tires on performance vehicles get similar mileage, so that is one of the reasons I went with 19" wheels. I have 5600 miles on mine, and before yesterday didn't have any noticeable wear at all -- after some hard laps at the track, the outside edges are noticeably worn a bit, but nothing excessive.

@John38 - if you haven't been doing burnouts, and the tire wear is very non-uniform (heavy wear on the inside) then based on other threads this is almost certainly a camber issue. Less than 10,000 miles is NOT normal. There are documented cases on this forum of people with minimal wear levels at their first service.

If you are not getting any joy from your local service I'd escalate up the service chain. They need to check the camber angle.

Aside from alignment, the MS really needs 9.5" wide rims in the rear with 255 or 265 wide tires to better handle all that torque and weight IMO. 8.5 front 9.5 rear

MS uses over 2 degrees of negative camber and, apart from "bolt slop" it is not adjustable. I have found that anything near negative two will fry the inside shoulder of low profile tires in short order.

Following up with the low profile comment above, the larger rears should wear the inside shoulder faster.

The only solution I have found (apart from putting large sidewall tires on the car ala 19"s) is to fabricate arms to reduce camber. Mine now has about minus one (almost matching the fronts).

as someone who is considering this car i read this thread in hopes of learning about a potential issue then became interested in what Lola was doing with the whole customer stuff. Once I looked at the thread you have made on TMC I realize I know nothing about cars as I understand absolutely nothing about what you talking about.

So can someone sum the findings about the tire issues in this thread up for me in non-gearhead language? I have no idea what a Camber is or how those numbers have any impact on anything.


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