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Quick question on quick220 charger

I've been thinking of buying one so that I can use it whenever visiting friends and family without a 220v outlet. I'd like the option of packing one and possible plugging it in so I can enjoy my model s more and not have to leave it inside the garage for longer periods when visiting. I sometimes make quick trips to relatives and would need to stay overnight just to charge for a little.

I would like to know if anybody already bought this device and if its safe and any good. I'd like to use it every now and then and wouldn't want to burn somebody else's house.

1. Is it safe?
2. How many miles/hr does it charge on average assuming its the legs are 110v 15amp?
3. Does it have an effect on my insurance.
4. Is this the most cost-effective solution in the market right now?

Thank you very much guys. I really appreciate your answers and hopefully this topic also helps anyone else with the same question as I have.

1. Yes.
2. About 7
3. If your house burns down due to an electrical problem, then insurance might have an issue since it isn't code compliant.
4. Most cost effective is to build one yourself, but it requires some knowledge as it requires 2 or 3 relays and some kind of indicator light, let me know if you are up for that challenge. Otherwise, it is a good product.

I'm assuming you meant the product from this site:
http://www.quick220.com

Looks like an interesting product. The question is if the mobile connector with the nema 5-15 adapter will be ok taking 240V.

With the nema 14-50 adapter the 2 legs 110v legs are fed separately and the car takes care of putting them together (or maybe it is the mobile connector that does the combining).

Anyhow I bought a 14-50 receptacle and a 5-20 cord from amazon and made a cable to charge at 16 amps instead of 12 while at the office from a 20 amp receptacle following shop's instructions: http://cosmacelf.net/Home%20Made%20Adapters.pdf which I got from this thread: http://www.teslamotors.com/forum/forums/bag-spare-adapters
With it I get 4+ miles per hour of charging which almost gets me back the 50 miles it took me to get there.

I am now looking at making a cable with 2 nema 5-15 plugs to charge at 240v 12amps (or 16 depending on the outlets), but instead of the fancy circuitry the above product has I will just keep a multimeter with me to measure across the 2 hots to see if I have the correct outlets.

@create - it isn't that simple to create a 2x120V adapter. I tried it and found that when the adapter is plugged into the Tesla UMC, the Tesla UMC completes a circuit between the two hots of the two 120V plugs. What this means in practice is that when you plug one 120V plug into the wall, the other 120V PLUG will have 120V on it. This is a major electrocution hazard. Plugs should never be energized, only receptacles. That is why if you want to build your own 2x120V adapter, PLEASE use relays that will de-energize the circuit unless the plug is plugged in.

Here's the circuit that I used to build my own:

http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/14460-Generating-220V-from...

Later on in that thread are pictures of what my adapter looks like.

BTW, Steam Brite also makes one that costs $250 and includes 2x25' cords:

http://www.steambrite.com/power-joiner-step-inverter-converter-takes-dua...

BTW, note that all of these converters, home made or otherwise, will not work on GFCI protected receptacles.

Whichever one you get, make sure you have an appropriate Tesla UMC adapter for the output receptacle that is used.

And no, you can't use Tesla's NEMA 5-15 UMC adapter to try to feed 240V into it - you have to use a 240V adapter like the 10-30, 14-30, 14-50 or 6-50.

@shop
Thanks for great answer. I am not sure if I can build one on my own, i would rather have an expert create and validate it.

The steambrite looks a little heavy but sturdier (not sure how it actually compares to quick220. Would you recommend steambrite against quick220? The price seems in favor or steambrite.

You mentioned that I would still need Tesla's UMC adapter. I though I can just use this and then plug in the cable I got from Tesla (I am assuming the adapter for it comes standard), do I still to order it?

How do I know if the receptable is GFCI? Is there a tester I can use?

@create
Thanks for the input. I will be reading the resource you provided so I can understand this better. I am not sure if I am up for building one myself since I will be using this mostly as a charging option when I am travelling, which is going to be in someone else's house.

The Tesla UMC comes with the car. The end that plugs into an electrical source has adapters. The car comes with a NEMA 5-15 to plug into a wall outlet and a NEMA 14-50 to plug into a 50A 240V receptacle. Unless you wanted to buy for $45 a different Tesla UMC adapter (they have NEMA 10-30, 14-30 and 6-50), your 2x120V adapter would have to have a NEMA 14-50 female output so that you can plug the UMC into it.

The Quick220 products only seem to have a locking 20 amp receptacle as an output, which Tesla doesn't even sell an adapter for, so you'd have to make an additional adapter for that.

The Steam Brite does seem to be able to be bought with a NEMA 14-50 receptacle.

A GFCI protected receptacle USUALLY has those two little pushbuttons between the sockets - you see them in your bathroom receptacles. I say USUALLY because sometimes you can have a regular receptacle that is downstream from and protected from a GFCI receptacle elsewhere in a house or even through a GFCI breaker in the panel box. The rule of thumb is that any outdoor receptacle is GFCI protected and any receptacle close to a sink is GFCI protected.

Note that often the best way to charge at a friend's house is via their clothes dryer plug. That gets you 24A at 240V rather than the 12A at 240V that you would get from a 2x120V adapter. The dryer plug would need to be within the 20' of the UMC cable length and you would need a Tesla dryer plug adapter (there are two types) unless you made your own dryer plug adapter and used a 30' 50 amp extension cord, as described in the Home Made Adapters document that user create provided a link for.

And finally, whenever using these 2x120V or home made adapters it is VERY IMPORTANT to dial down the max. amperage setting on the charging screen before plugging it all together otherwise the Tesla will draw the default amperage for the UMC adapter in use (which for a 14-50 is 40 amps, which would hopefully trip a breaker, or worse, start a fire).

@shop
I browsed the pdf for the home made adapters and recall that one house I intend on charging at had a nema 5-15 receptacle which was used to power their washer and dryer with 20amp breakers. I was actually expecting a different receptacle but that was what I saw. They had an adjacent powder room as well as a garage adapters that looked like nema 5-20, not yet sure what breaker they were connected, but I do know there were a 30amp breaker i was trying to figure out where it was connected. When I tried connecting charge using one of the nema 5-20 receptables, I did get 4 miles/hr (so i'm assuming I don't need the adapter?). Tesla just reports 12A max for these plugs , as well as for the nema 5-15 (one connected to the dryer).

With that said, I wanted to know if I still need to create those plugs (dryer plugs or what else) that was mentioned there for that house (i would be visiting that house alot).

I think the Steambrite seems a better option based on what you said (even though the receptables had a test/reset and might be GFCI protected like you said). I am strongly considering this based on your recommendation.

I really appreciate your help with this.

If a dryer was plugged into a regular 120v household plug, then it must have been a gas dryer. Which means the dryer electrical plug is probably not being used.

@shop Yes your way is WAY safer. My thought was I would be careful of the order I would plug and unplug stuff. When plugging in, the UMC would be the last to be plugged in (after verifying 240V). The UMC would also be the first to be unplugged.

After seeing your post on TMC, I think I will give that a try instead. If I am in a hurry or someone else is un/plugging stuff it could be a problem if not done right...

I think I'll put the relays in a "junction" box and run a short 4/10AWG cord to the 14-50 receptacle I already have. Where should I take the neutral from for the 14-50? Does it matter?

thank you!

The Tesla UMC does not use the neutral at all. It uses the two hots and the ground. So when creating a 14-50 adapter to use with the Tesla 14-50 plug, I usually leave the neutral unconnected.

@shop One other thing, you mention that the home made adapter would not work on GFCI. Is that because of the ground? If so bummer. Probably does not make sense for me then. I was going to use this at work where there are a few outdoor 5-20 outlets but they are all GFCI as they should be. They are going to put in a few J1772 in the next couple months so for now I'll just continue to use the 5-20 to 14-50 adapter I made using your pdf (thanks!).

A 2x120 adapter won't work on a GFCI protected plug because what the GFCI does is measure that current going through the hot matches the current going through the neutral. This is to ensure that current isn't leaking out somewhere else, like through your body (ie a shock hazard). But the 2x120 adapters use only the hots and current flows between the two hots of each 120v receptacle. The GFCI will sense this and trip immediately.

Yes, sounds like waiting for the J1772 is the right thing to do for you. Glad to hear the NEMA 5-20 is working for you!

Frankly, I'm kinda appalled that Tesla is taking so long to make adapters. They have a nice set of them for the Roadster, but a much smaller set for the Model S. and they always seem to be out of stock of what they do have. What are their manufacturing batch sizes? 10 at a time? And why no 5-20, 6-20, 6-30 etc?

@shop

A 2x120 adapter won't work on a GFCI protected plug because what the GFCI does is measure that current going through the hot matches the current going through the neutral.

Does this apply to the Steambrite? The receptacles I mentioned probably had GFCI.

Yes, any 2x120v adapter is going to have the same issue. I can't think of a way around it.

@shop thanks. I think they have a few more receptacles that are nema 5-15. I am assuming that the steambrite should give me roughly 7miles/hr? What amps should I be setting the car?

@shop
i was told steambrite uses a nema 14-30. If i currently have a nema 10-30, can i just use an adaptor such as this?

Conntek 14315 RV 1.5-Foot Pigtail Adapter Power Cord RV 50 Amp Male Plug To RV 30 Amp Female Connectorhttp://www.amazon.com/dp/B003YDY7YK/ref=cm_sw_r_an_am_ap_am_us?ie=UTF8

Or do i need to buy a tesla nema 14-30 adapter?

I think its nema 14-30R

Note that the circuits might be protected by a GFI breaker -- this is especially true for older houses that major electrical work done.

If you make your own adapter and leave the neutral on a 14-* receptacle unconnected -- be very sure to put a label on it saying it is only for Tesla use. If you were to plug in something expecting the neutral to be connected (such as an RV), it could be very dangerous as the 120V devices in the RV would bridge the two hots and the voltage drop across each leg would vary based on how much current is being drawn on each one -- some devices could easily see much higher voltages than they are rated for.

i was told steambrite uses a nema 14-30. If i currently have a nema 10-30, can i just use an adaptor such as this?Conntek 14315 RV 1.5-Foot Pigtail Adapter Power Cord RV 50 Amp Male Plug To RV 30 Amp Female Connectorhttp://www.amazon.com/dp/B003YDY7YK/ref=cm_sw_r_an_am_ap_am_us?ie=UTF8Or do i need to buy a tesla nema 14-30 adapter?

@LuvTesla - no, those pre-made RV adapters are not what you want. First of all, they connect a TT-30 to a NEMA 14-50. Not a NEMA 14-30 or 10-30. Second, they aren't wired correctly even to adapt a TT-30 for the Tesla.

So, yes, you would need to buy a Tesla NEMA 14-30 adapter, or build your own. Be aware that you will need to dial down the amps on such a 2x120V adapter to 12 amps.

Jat's warning about GFI circuits is important. All 2x120V adapters WILL NOT WORK on GFI protected circuits - they will immediately trip the GFI. So outdoor receptacles are typically not going to work, nor are any receptacles installed near a sink.

The other thing you have to watch out for, of course, is that the two 120V receptacles that you want to use must not only be on different breakers, but each breaker must be on a different panel leg. You CAN determine this ahead of time if you know where the breakers are in the panel and look at their panel positions, but describing how to do it is too hard for my brain right now.

Of course, the 2x120 adapters will have some sort of indicator showing whether or not you are indeed plugged into two different 120V legs.

And IF the breakers are both 20A breakers, then in theory, you can draw 16A from them instead of just 12A which would probably give you 9 miles/hour of charging rather than 7.

@shop Thanks! My order for a steambrite just arrived but they delivered a nema 14-30 instead of a nema 10-30. I bought the 10-30 adapter from Tesla, now i have to buy the other 14-30. I am not sure why they gave me a different one from the image they had on the site though. I'll be calling them but I suspect it would be hard for me to ship it back. In any case I would need an adapter and then hopefully when I use it in my brother's house they have those two non gfci plugs on different legs. Thanks!

Just checked and the nema 14-30 adapter is sold out :(. I am really hoping to get to use it this holiday weekend when I drive over. I looked at the other options and they seem rather expensive at 58$. Is creating one trivial?

Called steambrite and they inadvertently shipped the wrong one. They told me that they can make one for me and take weeks to send or just replace the receptacles myself. They said round and the l-shaped prongs just need to be combined and the two vertical prongs can be interchanged. Is this correct?

Without looking at how they wired the steam bite box, I can't tell if its correct or not. Sounds like it might work.

You can always call your local tesla service center and see if they have one in stock. If I were Elon I would have fired the person in charge of the store and/ or purchasing long ago. There is no valid excuse for them continually being out of stock.

Eventually a Model S NEMA 6-15 adapter will be available to fit the quick220. Roadster owners have used the quick220 system (though every adapter imaginable is available to them at this point).

@shop
I am contemplating if I should just return the steambrite item and just have my brother setup a 220v plug. But then i'd have to worry about other places I might be visiting without one.

I agree, its just really weird to run out of those adapters. They are not that complicated to make and it just makes sense to keep a healthy stock. Poor planning and management.


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