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Dreamliner Batteries and Tesla Batteries

So, anyone know the risk for drivers? Is this related? Do we have to worry about battery fires and overheating? The good news, at least we aren't in the air!

Apparently the chemistry in the batteries are different. http://www.businessinsider.com/dreamliner-and-electric-cars-dont-use-sam...

let's see what else emerges..

I would imagine the cooling system and related safety systems inherent in the Model S design are less likely to be incorporated in the 787 due to airplane design constraints, but perhaps they should reconsider...

The fundamental chemistry of Boeing's cells is not different. It's the packaging that makes all the difference.

Tesla went to extraordinary lengths to protect against fire risk, because their product is a car that can experience severe impacts with passengers near the batteries. Boeing did not expect to design for this type of risk.

Model S battery pack has 8000 small cells instead a few large cells. That dramatically limits the total energy of an individual failed cell.

The cells are immersed in a liquid coolant that also suppresses fire. The pack is specifically designed to withstand a total thermal self-discharge of any cell without spreading to its neighbor. This prevents a chain reaction. Boeing did not do any of this.

The TM pack is far safer, and is the state of the art in battery safety.

In fairness to Boeing, the events they are dealing with clearly were unnerving for those JAL passengers, but it is very unlikely those localized flame-outs could have brought down the plane. Flight equipment battery fires on planes have happened for decades, and generally are not serious because the batteries aren't that big.

The real battery danger in aircraft has been with cargo flights. There, unmanaged shipping packages of large numbers of cells has brought down multiple UPS and FedEx jets and killed crew. As a result, the FAA has set up stringent new rules for battery airfreight shipments.

Boeing will have to take aggressive active battery management measures (in the direction that TM has already done) to quell public anxiety. Hope they act quickly to staunch the hit to their hard-earned reputation.

Boeing is a decent company with a long track record of fantastic service to society.

It is remarkable, and impressive to see that in this technology area at least, TM is well ahead of them.

Maybe it's time to make Iron Man 2 true and Elong brings out his electric airlpane ;)

He's working on it. End of the decade he expects to have a fully electric VTOL supersonic aircraft out there. Seriously.

Electric VTOL concept might be different project than electric jet: heavier than air VTOL planes, like helicopters, use a lot of energy just to get off the ground, weight of the vehicle is real killer there, and batteries still weigh a lot and jet engines are not very efficient at low speeds.

Electric propeller-powered plane OTOH is easy, there are plenty of them out there, some with rather good ranges already.

His first move will be to buy Boeing and convert the plants.

@Mark, thanks for the detailed explanation.

twang

No..no...and no

Sorry...I mean rwang

I seem to remember hearing that Tesla's safety precautions allows their battery to be air shipped. Has anyone else heard this?

Elon to the rescue! Tweeted Tesla and SpaceX will assist in any way they can to help remedy the 787 situation as soon as possible. Wow...

@Brian H

So, in which company do we buy stock?

@Anthony H -- Elon Musk holding company...

If Elon can help out, it could be the historic moment for Tesla awareness...

Too funny. If Tesla can get some publicity out of Boeing's battery woes, it will be a PR coup. Boeing's billion dollar Dreamliner fixed by scrappy car startup company :-)

"Tesla to replace dangerous Boeing LiIon packs" Heh. That would be some headline!

Anthony. Seems you'd have to wait till Boeing took a dive, and then buy both. The classic reverse take-over!


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